Stay Sharp, Say No to Marleau
As training camp approaches, there will be no shortage of forwards rumoured to be heading to the Toronto Maple Leafs in exchange for one or more of their excess defensemen. The two players currently being mentioned in the rumour mill, however, will command a little more than a spare part.
Those two players are Patrick Marleau, and Patrick Sharp.
Marleau enjoyed a comeback season in 2008-09, having perhaps his best all-around campaign in the National Hockey League. However, another abysmal display in the playoffs tarnished his accomplishments during the regular schedule, and as a result his captaincy was stripped in the off-season. While this no doubt lowers the 30-year-old’s (turns 30 in September) value, make no mistake, Marleau will not come cheap. The San Jose Sharks are well aware that without the added pressure, their former captain could return to his 80-point days.
But hey, this is Toronto. Nothing stops the center of the hockey universe from dreaming about acquiring star players. Not only do I think the Sharks would not trade one of their star players to a team in bare supply of assets, but I don’t think the Leafs are in need of a player like Marleau.
Considering the Leafs are still years away from realistically competing for the Stanley Cup, does it seem like a logical move to trade away a large portion of the Leafs’ assets for a player like Marleau? No way, Jose (sorry for that one).
Not only would Marleau be trending down by the time the Leafs are ready to compete, but Brian Burke would have to offer a significant deal in order to ply Marleau from the Sharks. Probably something like Ian White, a young scoring forward, and a draft pick. Quite simply, the Leafs are in no position to be trading for a first-line forward. If Burke is interested in acquiring a top-six player via trade, then he needs to target a second-line forward who won’t cost the farm.
In comes Patrick Sharp.
Sharp, who is just entering his prime at 27, had a 30-goal season derailed due to the injury bug in 2008-09. He’s somewhat of a late-bloomer, only finding his game during the 2007-08 campaign when he produced 36 goals and 62 points in 81 games. But offense is not the only facet of his game. Sharp can kill penalties and has proved to be a reliable two-way forward for the Chicago Blackhawks. In fact, the Hawks won 36 of the 61 games Sharp played last season. They only won 10 of 21 when he was absent (kudos to TheScore Sports Forecaster for that stat).
While not a proven commodity in the NHL, Sharp has the potential to put up 40 goals someday. If not, expect him to be a 30-30 guy throughout his prime years. He may not be first-line material, but he’s the kind of player you want on your second-line.
Not only that, but Sharp wouldn’t cost the Leafs a large portion of their assets. He’s younger, and his 3.9 million dollar cap hit is much more attractive than Marleau’s 6.3 million dollar price tag.
The Blackhawks appear to be primed for a Stanley Cup run, but one of the team’s most pressing needs is a stay-at-home defender to solidify the defensive zone coverage. So it begs the question: Would Stan Bowman be interested in trading Sharp for a defenseman like Jeff Finger and other assets?
Well, the Blackhawks have approximately 3 million in cap space. Considering Finger, who led the Leafs in blocked shots with 158 last season, makes $400K less than Sharp, the Blackhawks have nothing to lose. While it would require more than just Finger to get the deal done, the Leafs also have players to spare upfront. Does this not seem like a much more logical and realistic possibility compared to Marleau?
I also happen to think Sharp would look good alongside Mikhail Grabovski and Nikolai Kulemin. But maybe I’m getting ahead of myself now.
Also, I think I deserve a medal or something for that title. C’mon.
You stay classy, MLHS.
ronguillet@mapleleafshotstove.com
August 27th, 2009 at 2:40 pm
@ Jordan
I’m not going to get in to Voracek with you again, because clearly we disagree on him. But that is beside the point.
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I actually said a player like him. Someone who isn’t a proven top end talent yet but has a lot of potential to become one. It doesn’t mean him specifically.
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We will end up paying more for a proven top liner anyways… Especially someone like Marleau.
August 27th, 2009 at 2:40 pm
If Sharp could be had for cheap I would be game, but I’m certainly not that interested in seeing him pull on the blue and white.
Marleau is exactly the type of player the Leafs always used to go for – the second he steps on to the ice in a Leafs’ sweater he will be crap. Think Owen Nolan.
If a trade is to be made it is for a legit first line center – someone that can score, has some grit, and can win face offs. It’s one thing to build from the net out but to fill a hole at your first line center position last is probably the biggest mistake you can make.
August 27th, 2009 at 2:43 pm
Yeah I could see that working. MVR + prospect + conditional pick would probably be the way it would have to go … remember that Bergeron has been a second-line centre for most of his time in Boston, and has been a 70+ point player for the most part (or projected to that range when playing less than a full season), and also has a 30 goal season under his belt in that role. So it would take a bit to get him … IMO if he stays healthy it’s well worth the gamble.
August 27th, 2009 at 2:43 pm
Hey guys, how about the Hudler situation, its interesting that the IIHF is forcing him back to Det. This could be a blessing for the Leafs, and i know we should keep the picks/prospect, but I’d give that for a proven guy that didn’t get much ice time and buried on the 3rd to 4th lines. But this would let us move/bury salary (Stemps/Mayers) and get a good 2way c/w that could replace Poni’s spot after this season.
August 27th, 2009 at 2:44 pm
@Captain Morgan:
I have no problem with trading assets we do have … and we need to given the excess on the blueline … I’m just not up for trading those assets for pending UFAs who won’t be here when the team is ready to make a run, is all.
August 27th, 2009 at 2:53 pm
@ Blair and GB
You’ve just convinced me that we don’t want Marleau!
August 27th, 2009 at 2:57 pm
@Garrett
I agree totally with that Pal!! Especially, when you can sign them in the summer and only have it cost the hit to the cap and dollars, not assets.
August 27th, 2009 at 3:00 pm
As it stands right now, next years draft is gonna be a real disappointment.
August 27th, 2009 at 3:08 pm
Here’s a hypothetical question for anyone with the answer!
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If Phoenix was disolved, how does the league decide who gets who from their roster?
August 27th, 2009 at 3:18 pm
@TT
I don’t think that they have ever disolved a franchise…they merged two…I cannot see that happening at all, but if it did, then there would be a lottery for selection positions and all teams would be involved.
August 27th, 2009 at 3:33 pm
@TT
For the 1925-6 season the Hamilton franchise was dropped, with the players being signed by the new New York American franchise.
For the 1934-5 season Ottawa franchise moves to St. Louis named the St. Louis Eagles. This franchise folds the following year. On March 17, 1938 the Montreal Maroons played their final game. In 1941-2 the New York Americans change their name to the Brooklyn Americans, but end up withdrawing for the 1942-3 season.
The California franchise moves to Cleveland, renamed the Barons, and the Kansas City franchise moves to Colorado under the Rockies name. In 1978-9 season the troubled Cleveland franchise merges with the Minnesota franchise.
Thats all i could find regarding teams folding or dissolving nothing was mentioned about how it occurs, i believe Cappytain is correct with the lottery for draft positions and the teams players get league drafted, and i am assuming the cap would have to be raised but thats an assumption. I will be corrected if im wrong, which is nice!!
August 27th, 2009 at 3:44 pm
Maybe a morbit thought but this explains what would happen in the extreme opposite situation of a team dissolving!
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http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/article/647062
August 27th, 2009 at 3:48 pm
Wouldn’t the dissolving of a franchise just be the opposite of an expansion draft?
August 27th, 2009 at 4:01 pm
It appears that most of the Leaf Nation is divided on what the next step should be. Nice blog Ron, it certainly bought about debate. Most would believe we are in need of a couple high end forwards, as am I. Where do we get them, trade, free agency, it seems with BB, that drafting the likes of a Taylor Hall in not in the equation. Despite that many of us believe we should stand pat and let the young guys fight and struggle, still I think we have enough talent not to land us in a lottery pick standing of the league. So until they decide to total rebuild again we won’t be looking to the No. 1 pick for a bit.
Sharp is not the high end player we seek, although a great 2nd tier guy to complement, not what the Leafs need. Marleau? Maybe fits the bill but he is a UFA next year so save you assets.
Next year UFA’s is topped with Kovalchuk, next is Marleau in my opinion followed by Savard. Not a bad three but the list drops off from there. But I also don’t think the three will make it to next July 1 before resigning.
I believe Toronto’s best chance to get that high end guy is going to come out of teams with mismanaged caps. Either by grabbing them in trades where teams are trying to clear salary or jumping on them once teams fails to offer contract making them UFA. So until, next year or the year after, we will have to see what guys like Tlusty, Bozak, Stalberg and Kadri can do for us. Do not run our Cap to the max and sit like a predator in the bush.
August 27th, 2009 at 4:06 pm
Dear NHL, how’s that Winnipeg to Phoenix move treating you? This thing is so F ‘n ridiculous….I can’t wrap my head around it. That team is dead, not breathing, rigamortus has set in and the NHL is desperately administering CPR in the hopes of reviving a carcass dug up from the grave. I watched a documentary about hockey last night that included a “save the jets” segment. Fans raised $13 million in the hopes of keeping the team in Winnipeg but of course to no avail and the money was donated to charities. I don’t see much grassroots support like that in Phoenix. Where was the NHL when real hardcore hockey were fighting to keep a historic franchise in their city? Licking their chops over the phantom TV deal I guess. Anyway, as for Sharp or Marleau I say don’t do it. I like the idea of a Bergeron(his age is a factor)much more. A healthy Bergeron would be awesome!!
August 27th, 2009 at 4:33 pm
Gotta like how Buttman says the team should go to Winnipeg b4 Hamilton.
Smart move if dividing Canadians was his plan!
August 27th, 2009 at 5:07 pm
So some of you guys would rather have Bergeron who is making 4.75 mil, only played 74 games in the last 2 years because serious injurys, only scored 9 goals and 46 points in the last 2 years, and is still suspect to concussions……..over Sharp who played 141 games the last 2 years and put up 62 goals and 106 points and only makes 3.9 mil? Am I missing something. Bergeron is only 3 years younger, so dont tell me it has to do with age because 24 and 27 year olds are still young guys
August 27th, 2009 at 5:10 pm
Oh wait, Bergeron scored 11 goals the last 2 years, sorry! I doubt Burke would give hardly anything away for him because of his injury past. Same reason we know we wont get much for MVR right now even though he is a good top 4 defence. Maybe its me, but right now Sharp is alot higher on my “wanted” list then Bergeron, and I dont think Chicago will want the world for him.
August 27th, 2009 at 5:18 pm
Bergeron’s injury and concussion history is definitely a major concern of mine, as well. Because of that, I don’t think Burke should pursue him.
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Sharp would be higher on my list as well. It depends what Chicago is looking to get in return for him. They could flip him to a team who has enough space, that is willing to give up a high pick and prospect. They could certainly get that kind of return for him, IMO.
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Which is something that I don’t think the Leafs should get caught up in.
August 27th, 2009 at 5:24 pm
I think they would want something to help them for just this year though, wouldnt they? That makes sence. They want to win now, but without ruining next year with having to lose Toews and Kane. If they deal Sharp and put huet to the minors they will have just enough space to re-sign Kane and Toews and Keith. Thats where Im guessing Poni and White would be perfect. Poni could fill in for Sharp and is UFA next year, and White will still be RFA next year so he wont command top dollar, or they could still trade his rights. I wonder if that would ever work for both teams? If not we could always throw in that Calgary second round pick
August 27th, 2009 at 5:26 pm
@ danvertising
If anyone knows the value of prospects and high picks its the Hawks. I don’t see them accepting any less than your what you’re suggesting!
August 27th, 2009 at 8:01 pm
How about Bergeron for MVR straight up? They both have potential and injury concerns. We would probably have a to give a lower level prospect up as well.
August 27th, 2009 at 8:25 pm
@Jordan and danvertising
Yes, I would absolutely want Bergeron over Sharpe and yes his injury history is a concern, but that is one of the reasons why I think we can get him for less than Sharpe. Sharpe = about 4 or 5 guys we already have which is at most a decent 2nd line winger. You can’t go by Bergerons stats the last 2 years, he had a major concussion in 2006/7 and only played 10 games after being leveled from behind, then last year it took him a while to get going, but by the end of the year looked pretty good again, he started to hit, crash the net etc. If you go back 4 years Bergeron has 189 pts in 232 games and Sharpe has 172pts in 293 games, that is over 60 more games and almost 20 less pts with the first half of last year also being pretty much a right off for Bergeron. Bergeron has had 2, 70 plus pt seasons before his injury and Sharpes carreer high is only 62.
In summary for the same package I would still take Bergeron, but I think we could get him for less than what it would take to get Sharpe and that makes the injury risk worth it. Plus Bergeron has a way higher upside than Sharpe IMO.
August 27th, 2009 at 8:27 pm
Also, Chi has no real motive to move Sharpe this year, next year yes, but not this year. Boston is over the cap, still needs to sign Kessel (which they need winger depth more than center) and they have Savard and Kreiji as the number one and two centres.
August 27th, 2009 at 9:57 pm
You make good points for sure. I just don’t thin someone who had multiple 30 goal years isn’t top line potential
August 27th, 2009 at 11:16 pm
The Leafs need Marleau like they need a Sundin/Pierre Turgeon/insert media sensation-marshmallow without leadership here.
They’re all the same thing and I agree with Lescott that what does it matter if it’s Sharp out there or one of our kids. Don’t Fletcher this goddam team. Yes, Fletcher is a verb. The F-word!
So, start the season and see who looks good – if Burke’s plan to create competition and bring out the best in each player works, and a player on surprises, he could yield a better return during the season.
Not crazy about throwing in Exelby just to ‘make a deal.’ I think it would have to be a great deal to include him as a final piece. He might be a good soldier to have in a playoff series down the road. I’d rather have X-Man throwing bombs on D than some potential scam forward from Chi-town who goes bust after one good year.
August 28th, 2009 at 7:34 am
I fine with not changing a thing really. I am just not totally against bring a guy like Sharp in if its a good deal
August 31st, 2009 at 2:48 pm
Sharp Marleau Allison would make a deadly line in my books