Morning Mashup: Pondering the Big Questions

by on February 15, 2013 in Morning Mashup, Opinion - 2,321 Comments

Morning Mashup: Pondering the Big Questions
Abelimages/Getty Images
Share

On Wednesday, Wade Arnott, Phil Kessel’s agent, indicated his client’s apparent desire to spend the rest of career playing hockey for the Toronto Maple Leafs.  This, despite being disappointed in the club’s performance last season (I don’t even want to know what adjective he’d use to describe the two previous seasons in Toronto), and with little guarantee yet that this team is primed for long-term playoff success.

We’ll probably never know why the camera-shy Kessel wants to remain in a media-laden Toronto; Arnott seems to suggest it is an admirable inner desire to win in hockey’s mecca. Perhaps the better question is, what could it cost to keep him?

I took a quick look at Phil Kessel’s goal production for his time in Toronto, and he’s 11th in goal scoring league-wide with 101 goals (and a total of 212 points) from the 2008-2009 season to present.  And having plied his trade so effectively on a reasonable $5.4 million cap hit, he’s no doubt due for a raise either on or before July 1, 2014, when his current deal expires.

For some perspective, here are some useful take-aways from the above link:

  • Kessel has the fifth lowest salary of players in the top 20 in goal scoring over that time period, behind Anaheim’s Corey Perry and Bobby Ryan, Pittsburgh’s James Neal and the Islanders Matt Moulson (who, by the way, has got to be quietest three-time 30-goal scorer.
  • 8 of the 10 highest paid forwards in the league are in the top 20 goal scorers (Only Zach Parise, mostly due to injury; and Vinny Lecavalier, mostly due to awful, do not make that list), and all of those players carry $7.5 million + cap hits.
  • Of that same top 20, 12 of those players are currently on contracts that carry cap hits of at least $6.5 million per season, though even that number is deceptive.  Players like Jeff Carter and Ilya Kovalchuk are signed to long-term back-diving deals, while several players on the list (Kessel, Ryan, Neal and Carter again) are on RFA-age or “second contracts” and tend to be well below market value for marquee UFAs.

From what I can extrapolate from the above, the cost of Kessel’s loyalty should come in around or above $7.25 million a season on a five to eight year deal.  While my $2 million raise for Kessel might seem outlandish, far more reputable journalists than me have had similar thoughts.

Also compounding the issue is that Dion Phaneuf’s contract is up at the end of next season.  While he’s by no means the league’s top defenseman, I don’t suspect he’d be amenable to a deal for less than the $6.5 million he currently makes.  In a move similar to Minnesota, I could see Kessel and Phaneuf accepting identical long term deals a la Zach Parise and Ryan Suter.

An unfortunate difference is that Dave Nonis will not have the benefit of the old CBA, which allowed the Wild GM Craig Leipold to acquire the players at a significantly discounted cap hit.  Kessel and Phaneuf might not be Parise or Suter calibre, but timing might see them on similar cap hits.  But is it wise?

There’s nothing wrong with having two $7-million players on your team.  The question is, is it right if those players are Kessel and Phaneuf?  In doing so, you’d commit around 20% of the salary cap to two talented, but arguably incomplete players. Before signing off on such massive deals, Dave Nonis has to be thinking not just about whether both of these players make the team better now – unquestionably true – but if one or both are going to be the type of offensive leader and defensive leader, respectively, to take the team to a Stanley Cup victory. We may have a better handle on this question in another year’s time, but with the current time frame of the Leafs‘ theoretical path to contention, we won’t have a concrete answer before time comes to ink the paper.

Of course, the most difficult part when discussing the cost of keeping Kessel is that letting him go – either through free agency or trade – would be viewed as absolutely indefensible in many circles.

Given the cost that Brian Burke paid to ply Kessel from Boston in 2009, bringing Kessel in for a mere four to five potentially fruitless years would represent a total failure by the franchise to value and allocate resources towards meaningful on-ice product.  Also problematic would be the stigma surrounding any players acquired for Kessel, who would likely garner undue comparisons to Tyler Seguin or Dougie Hamilton, through no fault of their own.

As a means of sign-off, here’s a quote from my interview with Dave Poulin for the Annual; he gave me a gem regarding Mikhail Grabovski and Jordan Staal’s then-recent contracts that put’s Kessel’s agent’s words into better light:

I talked to another GM, and he said, “Don’t tell me I’ve signed a player to a bad contract.  If I have a player and I like him? I want to keep him.  Why do I want to go to the unknown? So, if I pay a premium to keep a player that I know – that I like – and that I know can play in this city, why do I want to go into an unknown market?”

Clearly, Wade is hoping that like is in the air.

***

Friday Morning Links…

Alec’s game in 10.  Sad trombone

Help the site; possibly win free stuff!

Jonas Siegel on the Leafs loss, some fun stuff on Grabovski, MacArthur and Fraser

Cam Charron snuck in some awesome statistical analysis inside a pre-gamer over at the Leafs Nation.

Hey, a highlight from last night’s game!

VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
Rating: 0.0/10 (0 votes cast)
VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)

Print article

  • BurkeDoingWork

    I’d love to see the leafs take advantage of colorado’s position and their incredibly stupid management team. O’Reilly would be a good fit in TO, and I think we could make a real blockbuster with him as the starting point. This is my dream trade (will not happen):

    To Toronto: Duchene/Stastny, o’Reilly

    To Colorado: Grabovski, Bozak, defenseman (would be very reluctant to move Gunnar but may be required here, I’d prefer to see Franson + Kostka go – they need as many D as they can get)

    Goes against expected asking price of a high end prospect plus a roster guy

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • SDezy

     Oh man.  Good thing for me I just drive my car to the TTC station (public transit).  I try to avoid filling up as much as I can.

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Zeus_the_friendly_hobo

     123 dollars a tank (50liter tank or 12 gallons)

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • BurkeDoingWork

    For defensive help in Colorado, maybe they’d like to have Liles back?! Really lacking a PMD and maybe that would keep them from demanding gardener in return

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Mike_84

    You are right it won’t happen. Duchene is there guy he ain’t going anywhere

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • SDezy

    That’s a very lopsided trade proposal for the Leafs lol.  If they want to hit the cap floor sure, but they would probably want better prospects in return

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Mike_84

    Gunnar is a perfect fit for them. He has a very controllable contract and is a great player.

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Black_Hawk

    Grabs=Statsny IMO

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • dlb

     someone said they’re too cheap to like that idea, but let’s pretend Bozak + Liles = RoR for the heck of it

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Zep2

    Carter Ashton has his 11th and is now #2 in Marlies for goals scored.\.

    He may end up to be a  quality bottom 6 goy who can chip in a few goals and be hard to play against

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Zeus_the_friendly_hobo

     I live out in the country approximately 30 miles from the major town where my wife works and my kid is in playschool. No public transport which would work for us. Would have to drive 20 miles and then over 1 hour to make the next 10 miles up 3 changes,
    I drive a fair bit as I have to make the journey twice. I spend around 4000-4500kr a month on gasoline. Thats 675dollars

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • dlb

     Gunnar + Mac = RoR

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • BurkeDoingWork

    Well he did have a weak year last season, but seems to be moving in the right direction again. I would be willing to pay the price for him, but if not available (I agree he’s their man and I don’t see him going anywhere) then my deal below would probably fetch us Stastny. Their need on the back end is desperate, and we have what they need. Franson would be a great fit there, so would Liles. Lots of options.

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • SDezy

     I’d hate to be Liles in having to return to Colorado.  He seems to like it a lot here in Toronto

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • dlb

     i think so

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • SDezy

    But you live in Sweden.  That’s the price you pay for living in such a beautiful country :)

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Mike_84

    could be a really good 3rd line guy

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • BurkeDoingWork

    I like him here too, good for the community. He’s fit in well, but Reilly will be knocking on his door come next season

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • BurkeDoingWork

    I could live with that, we’d have a bit of a logjam at C but someone could move over. Don’t mind seeing macA go, the hard part is Gunnar in any deal involving him

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • BringbackYushki

     ill take this further and suggest what if thrive was made by the same elite? think about that

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Zeus_the_friendly_hobo

     Yeah if thats so why am I punished with swedish hockey, lol.
    I would gladly take your gas prices, The Maple Leafs and a country that looks as close as you can get, with all the trees, in looking like Sweden. Plus you speak English.
    lol, why am I here.

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • Mike_84

    I would really like to keep Franson

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • SDezy

     I’m still an advocate of keeping him in the lineup.  Slowly work in Gardiner and Reilly in.  That said, I think Gunnars/Holzer/Kostka gets the boot

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • BurkeDoingWork

    Agree completely. They will surely be demanding him in a deal for ROR IMO

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)
  • dlb

     he pretty much immediately set down his roots here, linked on to a charity … i think he wants to stay
    i think we can expect to see a top 4 built around him and Phaneuf

    although, perhaps part of the Burke debacle was to make it easier for Nonis to ignore loyalties like this (i think it was more personality clash, but..)

    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0.0/5 (0 votes cast)
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)