Morning Mashup: Fraser’s back and now we wait

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As I’m sure you’ve heard by now, yesterday Mark Fraser came to terms with the Leafs just before his arbitration hearing for a sum of $1.275 million on a one-year contract.

From Fraser’s standpoint, as he was both arb-eligible and it made sense (here’s why it didn’t for Cody Franson), filing maximized his leverage as a restricted free agent by not allowing the the club to take all summer to nickel and dime him due to the looming third-party arbitration ruling. Fraser named $2 million as his price, while the Leafs were concerned the settlement would come in half-way between at around $1.4 million and were thus willing to settle at $1.275 million just before the hearing. In the end, a player and club should try to avoid the ugly arbitration process if they can and all the power to Mark Fraser, an honest player who will likely always go from short-term contract to short-term contract and has managed to more than double his last season’s salary on a one-way deal.

Now, good for Fraser and all, but did the Leafs have other options? With Fraser being arbitration eligible and having taken the route before, likely at the advice of The Honourable Mr. Justice Hugh Fraser, one option was that the Leafs could’ve seen it coming, not qualified Fraser to begin with, and banked on a Petter Granberg coming along and taking over his role on the bottom pairing for cheaper. Not only does it seem like a reach to bank on Granberg being NHL ready with no time to adjust to the North American game and rink size in the AHL, the Leafs would only be saving about $375,000 to do it given Granberg would make $900,000 in the NHL. A second option was to forget Fraser and run with Phaneuf, Gunnarsson, Liles, Gardiner, Ranger and Franson as the top 6, but this would leave the Leafs defence light on defensive D and penalty killing options. A third option was to go bargain shopping in UFA and dip into the unknown to save a few hundred thousand.

For me, though, there’s definite value in sticking with a known quantity who filled the #6D role pretty effectively,  and – laugh at this intangible if you want to – has the type of character  to his person you like to have in your favourite hockey organization. The deal on its own isn’t really an overpayment. Closest comparables in his pay range are fellow bottom pair guys like Sheldon Brookbank, Mark Fayne and Justin Braun. When Fraser filled the soft minutes third pairing role he played for the majority of the year, and not the top-4 role he flirted with at times toward the end of the season exposing him as out of his depth against faster more skilled players, he made  the Leaf net a tough place to hang out, played two minutes a game on the vastly improved Leaf penalty kill, and was strong down low and on the boards against the other team’s grinders. Last season, playing with Cody Franson gave him an outlet for keeping it simple and passing off the puck handling responsibilities on his pairing, and he’ll need, if not Franson because he’s moved up a pairing, someone who can do the same. A possible fit is beside Paul Ranger.

If the Leafs wind up moving a piece we rather not see them move to make the cap work, it’s the necessity of the Bernier deal and how the team used its compliance buyouts that will get the attention and rightfully so. We’ll have to wait and see.

With Fraser now on the books at $1.275m, here’s how the Leafs cap situation looks, dropping the likely Marlie-bound Trevor Smith and Korbinian Holzer from their capgeek page:

FORWARDS
Joffrey Lupul ($5.250m) / Tyler Bozak ($4.200m) / Phil Kessel ($5.400m)
James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Dave Bolland ($3.375m) / David Clarkson ($5.250m)
Frazer McLaren ($0.700m) / Jay McClement ($1.500m) / Nikolai Kulemin ($2.800m)
Joe Colborne ($0.600m) / Colton Orr ($0.925m)
RFA: Nazem Kadri
DEFENSEMEN
Dion Phaneuf ($6.500m) / John-Michael Liles ($3.875m)
Carl Gunnarsson ($3.150m) / Mark Fraser ($1.275m)
Jake Gardiner ($1.117m) / Paul Ranger ($1.000m)
RFA: Cody Franson
GOALTENDERS
Jonathan Bernier ($2.900m)
James Reimer ($1.800m)
OTHER
Buyout: Darcy Tucker ($1.000m)
Buyout: Colby Armstrong ($1.000m)
RETAINED SALARY TRANSACTIONS (0.778% of upper limit)
Matt Frattin ($0.437m—0.5%) Ben Scrivens ($0.062m—0.1%)
——
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $58,366,667; BONUSES: $300,000
CAP SPACE (19-man roster): $6,233,333

  • I don’t think the Leafs are going to move Franson. My one worry is that, even if the Leafs find a way to wedge everyone in with some relatively cheap settlements on Kadri and Franson, they may not be flexible enough to accommodate a surprise training camp/preseason performance from, say, a Jerry D’Amigo or Carter Ashton earning one of them a spot on the team. Both would earn over a million in the NHL. Scott Gordon wondered aloud yesterday if the limited cap space would allow the Leafs to add another guy into the mix for a lower roster spot – “As far as adding another guy, that would come down to what happens with the players that aren’t signed, and where the salary cap is, and if we have room or not.”
  • If the Leafs feel they could move Liles at any time, they may wait to see how the competition plays out in training camp. They can be up to 10% over the salary cap until the final day of camp.
  • You would obviously prefer to retain salary and trade him, but the John-Michael Liles buyout isn’t horrible as a Plan B or C. Year 3 is ugly, but you’re saving $3 million immediately and between the Tucker and Armstrong buyouts coming off the cap and Liles being jettisoned, they would have $5 million freed up for a huge 2014 off season (Phaneuf, Kessel, Reimer, Kulemin, Gardiner and potentially Bolland all needing contracts).
  • Here’s the JML buyout calculation. The post-arbitration buyout window opens on August 2nd.
    1. 2013-14: $875,000
    2. 2014-15: $875,000
    3. 2015-16: $2,375,000
    4. 2016-17: $1,250,000
    5. 2017-18: $1,250,000
    6. 2018-19: $1,250,000

A few Wednesday morning links…

An interview with assistant coach of the Leafs Scott Gordon
ICYMI, Anthony’s interview from yesterday.

Mark Fraser is going to wear a visor next season
Good call.

Cody Franson still unsigned and unsure of what the future holds
Cody doesn’t really express doubt here so much as he says his agent is handling it.

Top 25 under 25
PPP is starting their off-season series on the young Leafs.

Dave Bolland is taking the Stanley Cup on a parade route through Mimico
How does Lieweke feel about this? On the one hand he loves planning Stanley Cup parades, on the other he hates those who coast on past accomplishments.

Spencer Abbott is returning to the Marlies
The Leafs signed their former college signing Spencer Abbott to a one-year contract yesterday after a pretty good season with the Marlies.

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Alec Brownscombe is the founder of MapleLeafsHotStove.com, where he has written daily about the Leafs since September of 2008. He was also the editor of the 2009-12 Maple Leafs Annuals. You can contact him at [email protected]
  • Keon14

    Ha: “How does Lieweke feel about this? On the one hand he loves planning Stanley Cup parades, on the other he hates those who coast on past accomplishments.”
    Fucking Bolland reliving past glories.

  • Jordan29

    I hope Franson and Kadri both take similar deals like Gunner, Bozak, Clarkson and even Orr who took less salary next year then the rest of the deals to keep the cap hits down

  • Jordan29

    Lets be honest though, if the trade makes sense I would deal Franson and keep Liles instead. I dont think long term it kills us with the potentially high skill depth we ave in defence

    • 4evrblue

      Jordan29 what are we getting back though? draft picks are the only thing that makes sense if we are trading him for cap purposes and they are risky. Unless its multiple firsts I’m just not sure it would be the best course of action.

  • 4evrblue

    Love Fraser and am glad he’s back. We’re going to be a hard hitting team again this year :)

  • WendelGilmour

    The Top 25 Under 25 is actually pretty good (for PPP), the writer isn’t dripping with sarcasm and unwarranted criticism. Even if I disagree with some of it, many are ranked about where I have them.

    • 4evrblue

      WendelGilmour I don’t even see a list. Just an article that says there will be a list lol

      • maple1967leafs

        I couldnt find a list

        • mORRganRielly

          maple1967leafs They had one last year.  It’s there.  Their search function isn’t the best.  A lot of their content is hard to find.

        • 4evrblue

          mORRganRielly maple1967leafs yeah I found last years easy enough, old news and old prospects though. Looking forward to this years list when it comes out.

  • Burtonboy

    Fans ( me included ) worry too much about cap space.

    • 4evrblue

      Burtonboy have to admit it makes for good discussion at this time of year though. especially when you talk about players possibly being moved because of cap space. truth is we’re no different than any other team in previous years that looked like they would have to move valuable players to get under the cap and didn’t.

      • Burtonboy

        4evrblue Burtonboy Yep it does and I’ll keep talking about it lol. ( nothing else to do ) Thing is when I look at it seriously though  we have a long way to go and teams, leafs included always come up with ways to get under the cap . Holmgren has made a science out of it FFS lol

        • 4evrblue

          Burtonboy lol science, magic, call it what you want. We’ll be fine come training camp with all of our important pieces in place, thats the main thing :)

        • Burtonboy

          4evrblue Burtonboy I’m pretty sure they’ll get it figured out .

    • Knights2Leafs

      Burtonboy 
      You’re probably right in that.  It’s just that this is the worst year to have to try and get under the cap with the internal budget of many teams and the reduced cap of all.  I’ve felt pretty good the last couple of years the way the Leafs have managed the cap to put them at an advantage and then within weeks we have lost that advantage.
      Grrr – all that said,  I will never stop bitching about the Armstrong buyout. We could use that $1M right now. The very second I heard that I thought WTF, why are we trying to do Armstrong any favours and that was before he became a jerk about it.

  • Optimustic

    I hope we get both Franson and Kadri signed without moving other pieces, but if we don’t, it’s hard to say who could be moved.   Most other teams want inexpensive young players and may be willing to give up more to get them than JML.   I wouldn’t be surprised if one of our other D is moved instead of assuming that JML is bought out or traded.

    • Burtonboy

      Optimustic Which other D would we move though?

      • Optimustic

        Burtonboy Optimustic Not that I want to move any, but Gunner, is one.  Even Gardiner if we’re offered a good return and Fraser if Granberg is ready to take his place, though I doubt it.

        • Burtonboy

          Optimustic Burtonboy Personally I would let Franson walk first before letting Gardiner or Gunnar go . Fraser will have to compete hard for his spot anyway I think . Granberg and Blacker are gonna push him hard.

        • Optimustic

          Burtonboy Optimustic I’m not giving Gardiner away for sure, I want good prospects and or Picks for him.   Tough to say how good Granberg and Blacker are as I haven’t seen them much.  But you’re right, they’ll push him this year and likely replace him next year.
          We’re so deep on D that maybe one of our prospects could be included in a larger deal.  Maybe JML and Blacker for a forward and D

        • Burtonboy

          CanuckUKinToronto Burtonboy Optimustic I think we would wind up with far too many PMD’s if we let Gunnar go . Not liking our defense right now if we have Liles,Franson,and Gardiner in at the same time . Dion is offensive and even Ranger tends to jump up into the play a lot . We need more shutdown d then just Fraser

        • mcloki

          Morning gents. Injuries are going to sort this out sooner rather than latter.

        • Knights2Leafs

          Burtonboy
          I get what you’re saying, but really of Gardiner, Phaneuf, Franson and Liles, the only one that seems to play like a rover is Gardiner.  I think the other 3 would pick their spots. Add Ranger into that mix and I would say he and Phaneuf are both veteran enough to play shut down when they need to. 
          I would not be happy with the loss of Gunnar, but I think Franson has the better potential in the long run especially as a RD.

        • Burtonboy

          Knights2Leafs Burtonboy I’m not sold on Ranger yet or Franson for that matter being able to play an effective 2 way role. I want to keep them all but I think losing Gunnar right now would create a bigger hole then people realize

        • Knights2Leafs

          Burtonboy
          That I agree with.  It really boils down to whether the loss of Franson or Gunnar is the bigger loss and I don’t like the idea of either.  If we don’t get “rid” of Liles this year, we are only delaying the inevitable because I don’t see him here for another 3 years.

        • Burtonboy

          Knights2Leafs Burtonboy Neither do I  . Good chance Fraser won’t be around long term either . We will see what happens with Franson and Ranger but I wouldn’t be giving Franson a long term deal just yet . If he plays like he did in the 48 games schedule then yes sign him up long term

        • leafscapguru

          CanuckUKinToronto Knights2Leafs Burtonboy that is if he still has it, but some guy do better under pressure hope he is one of those guys

        • Burtonboy

          CanuckUKinToronto Knights2Leafs Burtonboy Whose been out of the NHL for 4 yrs . We will see

        • Dink

          Burtonboy Knights2Leafs Fraser probably won’t be back next year, I agree

        • Dink

          CanuckUKinToronto Burtonboy Knights2Leafs   resigning Fraser and also Ranger really shows that all the youngsters will play one more year at the minor level in the eyes of Leaf mgt.

        • Burtonboy

          @Dink CanuckUKinToronto Burtonboy Knights2Leafs Actually those deals with Ranger and Fraser are structured in a way that we could send both to the Marlies if a youngster made a case to be in the lineup this yr. We have to clear cap space anyway so the little bit of a hit we take for sending those guys down in minimal

  • Burtonboy

    CanuckUKinToronto I posted the signing when it happened . Very little response . People are not interested in talking about Sharks I guess.

    • Optimustic

      Burtonboy CanuckUKinToronto I remeber you posting it, It just didn’t surprise me.  Is it not a good signing?  I think it’ll be a good deal when the cap rises again.

    • Optimustic

      CanuckUKinToronto Burtonboy I like Clarkson ( we all do as far as I know ) but the concern is – with his style of play, will he still be the same player by the end of his contract?
        I don’t see the Western teams much so I don’t know Pavelski as well, but I think he’ll likely be nearly as good then as he is now.

    • Knights2Leafs

      CanuckUKinToronto
      I can live with the Clarkson signing but the 2 deals are not even close. Pavelski at 5 years much better than Clarkson at 7. Plus Pavelski is a mid range top 6 guy where Clarkson is lower on the top 6 ladder.
      Further context.  Grabo at $5.5M or Pavelski at $6M.  Not even close. Pavelski is a true 1B center.

  • Gerg3d

    Does anyone know if the second buyout window is contingent on an arbitration settlement?  Have the Leafs lost this opportunity by not taking Fraser to arbitration?

    • Burtonboy

      Gerg3d My understanding is they still have a buyout option . As long a s a team had 2 arb filings they meet the criteria

      • Gerg3d

        Burtonboy Gerg3d thanks for clearing that up.

      • gravyface

        Burtonboy Gerg3d I thought they had to actually go to arbitration, but might be a loophole/misinterpretation if I’m reading this correctly: 
        “However, in the event that a Club has only one salary arbitration
        hearing pursuant to Section 12.3(a) in a given League Year, such Club shall not be entitled to
        exercise such an Ordinary Course Buy-Out outside the regular period.”

        So we had a hearing scheduled but never actually had the hearing…

        • Burtonboy

          gravyface There are different opinions out there for sure. Wish a lawyer who has experience with CBA’s could give an opinion . I haven’t heard one yet

        • gravyface

          Burtonboy gravyface would be something for Alec to pursue with the Leafs brass this summer maybe?

        • Dink

          gravyface Burtonboy Gerg3d no one had a hearing

        • gravyface

          @Dink gravyface Burtonboy Gerg3d Thats what I’m thinking too: two filings, zero hearings equals no Ordinary Buyout available this year.

      • Burtonboy

        CanuckUKinToronto Burtonboy Gerg3d Gunnar

      • Knights2Leafs

        Burtonboy
        Busy summer, so hard to keep up, but is the second buyout option only for 48 hours?

        • Burtonboy

          Knights2Leafs Burtonboy opens 3 days after the last scheduled hearing and then only for 48 hrs

        • Dink

          Burtonboy Knights2Leafs wasn’t Zuccarello the last one?

        • Burtonboy

          @Dink Burtonboy Knights2Leafs Yep

  • http://twitter.com/jmckelvie RielledUp

    Aren’t you suppose to judge an off-season on how the season is going?… How can people say it’s a really bad off-season when the Leafs haven’t played one game? Jesus Christ I fucking hate PPP.

    • Uncle Otis

      RielledUp 
      Which is why I never go there..
      Gets us too “rielled up” which is their preferred outcome
      #TrollsRus

    • DWCMLHS

      RielledUp People can judge moves as they happen… If a team makes a deal, and one believes – given the information available at the time it is made – that it is unlikely to benefit the team when they do start playing, there’s nothing wrong with saying that.

  • LePetomane

    We got about 5 mil in cap space, we got 2 guys we can probably get signed for 6.5 mil..
    I don’t feel that can’t be done…it is well within the grasp

    • Dink

      @LePetomane 
      Isn’t this Le Petomane?
      https://www.google.com/search?q=le+petomane&rlz=1C1GGLS_enUS363US363&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=AAP5UfmUEfiv4APZtoHACQ&biw=1002&bih=494&sei=CAP5Uf3lC4na4APym4CQCg#facrc=_&imgdii=yeS0e8S-d23PTM%3A%3BSaolpSUXAQRJHM%3ByeS0e8S-d23PTM%3A&imgrc=yeS0e8S-d23PTM%3A%3Bx6rz7PEJYKWk6M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.mundieart.com%252Fjgm%252Fimages%252Fjgm-66.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.mundieart.com%252Fjgm%252Fdrawing35.htm%3B500%3B628

  • leafscapguru

    CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
    My Custom Lineup
    FORWARDS
    Joffrey Lupul ($5.250m) / Tyler Bozak ($4.200m) / Phil Kessel ($5.400m)
    James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Dave Bolland ($3.375m) / David Clarkson ($5.250m)
    Joe Colborne ($0.600m) / Jay McClement ($1.500m) / Nikolai Kulemin ($2.800m)
    Frazer McLaren ($0.700m) / Nazem Kadri ($2.750m) / Colton Orr ($0.925m)
    Jerry D’Amigo ($1.083m) /
    DEFENSEMEN
    Dion Phaneuf ($6.500m) / Carl Gunnarsson ($3.150m)
    Jake Gardiner ($1.117m) / Paul Ranger ($1.000m)
    Mark Fraser ($1.275m) / Cody Franson ($3.800m)
    Korbinian Holzer ($0.788m) / Petter Granberg ($0.900m)
    GOALTENDERS
    Jonathan Bernier ($2.900m)
    James Reimer ($1.800m)
    OTHER
    Buyout: Darcy Tucker ($1.000m)
    Buyout: Colby Armstrong ($1.000m)
    Buyout: John-Michael Liles ($0.875m)
    RETAINED SALARY TRANSACTIONS (0.778% of upper limit)
    Matt Frattin ($0.437m—0.5%) Ben Scrivens ($0.062m—0.1%)
    ——
    CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
    (these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
    SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,686,667; BONUSES: $612,500
    CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $225,833
    I see this a being a real possibility

    • leafscapguru

      sorry Kardi is supposed to be on the 2nd lie and bolland 3rd McC on 4th lines

    • Dink

      leafscapguru no offence, but I am starting to not like capgeek

      • Burtonboy

        @Dink leafscapguru Cap geek is a bit funky that way

    • leafscapguru

      CanuckUKinToronto leafscapguru his no trade clause may screw things up with that, as most team he may accept a trade to will be fighting cap space as well.  I would rather trade JML to the islanders with a conditional 5th for Martin but they may be a team that JML doesn’t want to go to

      • MaxwellHowe

        leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto Think the Leafs would go to him and say – look, you can be bought out, get 2/3 of yo money and spend the rest of the summer trying to find a job, or you can accept a trade to NYI or EDM and get yourself paid in full and get a spot on the roster.  Tell us within 48 hrs.

      • leafscapguru

        MaxwellHowe leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto 
        lets hope that he does say yes

      • MaxwellHowe

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto
        Doesn’t seem like much of a choice to me.  Judging by Grabo’s tantrum, players don’t like being bought out.  Must be a shot to the ego.

      • leafscapguru

        MaxwellHowe leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto true but the only real places for JML would probably be, OTT, COL, NYI,BUF, CGY, AND, FLORIDA  Edmonton doesn’t have the space for him

      • MaxwellHowe

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto 
        Looks like its up to NYI to solve our salary woes then.  Excuse me while I puke in a corner

      • Burtonboy

        MaxwellHowe leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto 
        Still think Col. could be an option . Wonder what Sakic thinks of JML?

      • leafscapguru

        MaxwellHowe leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto 
        Snow doesn’t seem like he’s the best GM I think Nonis could pull it off if JML said yes to the trade

      • MaxwellHowe

        Burtonboy MaxwellHowe leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto I doubt Sakic thinks of JML at all.

      • MaxwellHowe

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto 
        If they want Snow to take JML, put him on waivers.  Snow checks on waivers, like, 10 times a day.

      • leafscapguru

        MaxwellHowe Burtonboy leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto it’s to bad we couldn’t trade cash for a player leafs would be stacked then ( i know this isn’t possible because leafs would take advantage of this)

      • Burtonboy

        MaxwellHowe Burtonboy leafscapguru CanuckUKinToronto They played on the same team for quite a while .

      • Dink

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto I believe Detroit is looking very hard at our defensive strength, whether the 2 would deal? who knows…

      • leafscapguru

        @Dink leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto Detroit is in a jam with cap space as well don’t think we would do the deal cause we would have to take a player back with a hefty salary

      • Dink

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto This is not the year to worry about who you deal with anyways..and look how many deals we did with Boston in our own division.

      • Dink

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto They will move Tootoo..guaranteed…then watch out

      • leafscapguru

        @Dink leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto wasn’t worried about doing a deal with Detroit but we are trying to clear space not take on another contract

      • Dink

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto Isn’t trading a Gunnerson or Franson clearing cap space?

      • leafscapguru

        @Dink leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto sorry i was referring to getting rid of JML to sign Kadri and franson

      • Dink

        leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto when it comes down to it, anything could happen I reckon

      • leafscapguru

        @Dink leafscapguru MaxwellHowe CanuckUKinToronto very true i think there will be a lot of 3 way trades leading up to the season so that teams will have cap space

    • Burtonboy

      leafscapguru Looks to be a definite possibility right now for sure

    • B_Leaf

      leafscapguru 
      This is exactly how I see things right now…Franson may not get 3.8 but he might too…I guess it depends on term.

      • Burtonboy

        B_Leaf leafscapguru Nonis still needs to sign Kadri and Franson as cheap as he can even if he does buyout Liles . We need some wiggle room to fill the roster and be able to run effectively

        • leafscapguru

          Burtonboy B_Leaf leafscapguru Kadri at 2.75 and franson at 3.8 was being nice i think Nonis can still get it lower

        • Burtonboy

          leafscapguru Burtonboy B_Leaf Too much for Franson IMO but if thats what it takes,thats what it takes

        • B_Leaf

          leafscapguru Burtonboy B_Leaf 
          I think that number is bang on for Kadri, but I can still see Franson a bit lower. Why? Because if he went to arbitration he likely gets $3-3.2M. Then the club can take two years. So that to me is the starting point. If you eat another year it gives Franson more security and the Leafs another UFA year. But for Franson to give another UFA year he needs $, but UFA market is a little light because everyone is up against cap…Anyway in the end I wouldn’t be surprised with Gunnar money at 2-3 years or maybe 3.4 for four years, or 3.5 for five.

        • Burtonboy

          B_Leaf leafscapguru Burtonboy I think he should come in somewhere just slightly above Gunnar but we will see

        • leafscapguru

          Burtonboy B_Leaf leafscapguru i was thinking it would be 3.8 for 4 yrs for franson and Kardi 2.75 for 2 yrs

  • Uncle Otis

    Love having Fraser back..salary is right where it should be so no sense dwelling.
    Nonis should have a plan, time will tell
    Oh,and that pic is priceless :)

  • Dink

    Is arbitration over now?

    • Burtonboy

      @Dink Yes . With the Zucerrello signing yesterday there are no other hearings scheduled

      • Dink

        Burtonboy I wonder if thats happened before with no actual hearings taken place in arbitration

        • Burtonboy

          @Dink Burtonboy You don’t see a whole lot of these things ever reach the actual hearings anyway . Not sure if we have ever gone a season with out one but I wouldn’t be surprised if we have

  • leafscapguru

    I would find it hilarious if Grabo signed another contract with some team who uses there compliance buyout on him next season (guy would be pissed and leave to the KHL probably)

    • Kouba

      leafscapguru Leave Grabo alone :)

      • leafscapguru

        Kouba leafscapguru lol sorry just thought of it

    • Mind Bomb

      leafscapguru  Ha 2 buyouts ? He would leave for the Lifestyles of the Rich and famous lol

      • Dink

        Mind Bomb leafscapguru lol wonder if the same guy can be bought out twice? 
         bet the players association would have something to say

        • leafscapguru

          @Dink Mind Bomb leafscapguru don’t think the player has any say in it its up to the team if they have one or not

        • Mind Bomb

          @Dink Mind Bomb leafscapguru haha only if Grabo Complained and with the amount of money those 2 Buyouts would give him yikes, Poor Fraser is Fighting tooth and Forehead for a measly couple hundred K, and Grabo is lighting his cigar’s with that lol

  • Mind Bomb

    Good morning Folks !

    • Burtonboy

      Mind Bomb Morning MB

      • Mind Bomb

        Burtonboy Mind Bomb Morning BB, So Fraser CAP’S off July. August should bring some Fun, Big leafs Trade coming ? Could be !

        • Burtonboy

          Mind Bomb Burtonboy Something has to happen . What is the million dollar question lol

        • Mind Bomb

          Burtonboy Mind Bomb Pavalski Sigining sucked, he was one of the * Out of the Blue* Targets I thought might make a good trade. Any thoughts on any other out there possibilites ?

        • Burtonboy

          Mind Bomb Burtonboy None that I see right now . We need a 1 C and a top pairing d-man . Rare commodities for sure

        • Mind Bomb

          Burtonboy Mind Bomb You know, being this close to the Cap, it eliminates a lot of Fantasy Trade scenario’s
          Screw Nonis lol

        • Burtonboy

          Mind Bomb Burtonboy This yr is an anomaly. Things will pick up once the teams are over this cap crunch

        • Mitch_S2

          Burtonboy Mind Bomb Kadri and Franson for Tavares 😉

        • Mind Bomb

          Mitch_S2 Burtonboy Mind Bomb Done !!!!

        • rustynail

          Mitch_S2 Burtonboy Mind Bomb pass

        • Mind Bomb

          rustynail Mitch_S2 Burtonboy Mind Bomb Morning Rusty, you think that is over paying ? Or you just like Kadri ? Really there is not a more Friendly Contract vrs Production in the NHL 
          5.5 for the next 5 years. Snow may not make trades, but that was a hell of a signing

    • MaxwellHowe

      Mind Bomb Mornin

      • Mind Bomb

        MaxwellHowe Mind Bomb Morning Max, hows things ?

        • MaxwellHowe

          Mind Bomb MaxwellHowe Good. Still being an asshole and laughing and laughing at some of the sillier statements that came from Leafs mgt

        • Burtonboy

          MaxwellHowe Mind Bomb I’m sure Leafs management laugh at some of the silly comments made by us as well :))))))

        • MaxwellHowe

          Burtonboy MaxwellHowe Mind Bomb Good call

        • Mind Bomb

          Burtonboy MaxwellHowe Mind Bomb  Haha BB, I can picture Nonis, Chuckling over some of them, Hey Claude check out the Dion Trade proposals :)

  • Burtonboy

    NHL UFA market essentially frozen
    http://thescore.com/nhl/articles/1243291-nhl-ufa-market-essentially-frozen

  • Burtonboy

    https://twitter.com/farwell590
    New Leaf and former London Knight Dave Bolland just bought a new house in London. Loves the city where he played his junior hockey

    For all you Knight fans lol.

    • Mind Bomb

      Burtonboy  Booo go STING !
      lol

      • rustynail

        Mind Bomb Burtonboy didn’t they get disbanded? :)

        • Mind Bomb

          rustynail Mind Bomb Burtonboy hahha

    • rustynail

      Burtonboy and he is bringing the cup her before he heads to Mimico

      • Burtonboy

        rustynail Burtonboy Boooooooooooooooooooo

    • skippysleafs

      Burtonboy Welcome home davey

  • Jay_Berg

    I’m wondering if a Liles for Tootoo swap would work?
    Detroit wants to upgrade their D and is apparently shopping Tootoo who can replace Komarov and free up about $2 million in cap space which would give us the breathing room we need to resign Kadri and Franson.

    • Burtonboy

      Jay_Berg Apparently there has been a lot of talk between Det. and Nashville about moving Tootoo back to the Preds

      • Jay_Berg

        I guess that would make sense. He was a fan favourite.
        At some point Nashville has to think of acquiring a forward who is capable of getting more than 20 points though lol. There forward lineup is pretty bad

  • Mitch_S2

    Starting the Top 25 under 25 at PPP, interesting to see Camerenesi has moved up 17 spots. 
    Looked at the old list, he was 32nd. Franson and Kessel are the only guys who I believe graduated based on age, but we also added a first rounder in Gautheir, and Bernier. 
    Kid starting to look Parise-esque

  • supercilious

    Re: dropping Holzer & Smith from the roster and getting Naz & Franson signed for inside that 6.23M. Has there been many teams that have started the season with only 21 players on the roster instead of 23?
    Looking at the UFA market for D it doesnt look like there is going to be any interest in Liles. You could probably acquire a Gilbert or an Ian White for cheaper less money than Liles is making and no assets would need to be given up for them.
    Buyout seems like the only option to me

    • leafscapguru

      supercilious never thought about that you raise a good point

    • Burtonboy

      supercilious I can see “maybe ‘ going with a 22 man roster but 21 is really cutting it pretty fine

      • leafscapguru

        Burtonboy supercilious I think the leafs will buy out JML his cap hit was lower than Komi’s in buyout terms for this year i believe this was there plan all along

        • Burtonboy

          leafscapguru Burtonboy supercilious Good chance your right. We will know within the next 5 days

        • supercilious

          Burtonboy leafscapguru supercilious The buyout solves the lack of roster spots “issue” as well. Holzer & Smith would stay up and you should even be able to sneak a D’amigo or the like up as well.

  • Zep2

    Morning all. Great read Alec.
    Fraser was a warrior for the Leafs last year. As Alec ,mentioned, not qualifying him was an option.  I think that would have sent a terrible message to his team mates. The one year deal gives Granberg, Blacker , Percy another year to develop.

    • Mind Bomb

      Zep2  Morning Zep

    • ErikGruber

      Zep2 I wonder if he would have made a difference in Game 7

      • Zep2

        ErikGruber Zep2 There would have been more push back against Lucic.  If Carlyle gave him the minutes

        • B_Leaf

          Zep2 ErikGruber 
          Without a doubt Lucic would have met up with Fraser…Fraser is one of the few NHL Dmen strong enough to hold his own with Luci

        • playoff nut

          B_Leaf Zep2 ErikGruber And that would have been worth the price od admission ,I think it will be a good fight but Fraser wins

  • ErikGruber

    So if we can’t fit an extra forward into our lineup, we will be rolling 3 lines on road trips when someone gets injured?

    • Mind Bomb

      ErikGruber  Or Double shifting our Centers, I liked Kadri extra shifting with ORR :)

  • B_Leaf

    Fraser never played hard minutes but he also didn’t play soft minutes either. His TOI actually rank him as a good number five guy, even though we think of him as a number six.
    The key is that in his assignments and TOI he played extremely well. Also I thought he handled the extra TOI late in the season very well, he just had a little bad puck luck or nerves early in the playoffs. We probably could have used him big time in game seven when Lucic and co. stepped up and got very physical.
    It has been mentioned on here a fair bit lately…but he also has a good first pass…he can even make some really good stretch passes. He got a lot of ice time with the Kadri line and always seemed to find Naz with the pass.

    • Zep2

      B_Leaf Yeah , but he played those minutes hard. His coach and team mates appreciated that

      • B_Leaf

        Zep2 B_Leaf 
        Oh yeah, totally hard…I just meant in regards to quality of competition. I don’t have the numbers in front of me but I think it was just around even or a little to the tougher side. But yes he was tough and max effort all the time, very consistent too.

    • playoff nut

      B_Leaf Yes a real good #5 ,comon Lucy ,try that again u !@#!

    • djamon

      B_Leaf #5 and #6 are the same…they play with each other.

      • B_Leaf

        djamon B_Leaf 
        No not really. Generally your #5 will play more TOI, because of PK or PP responsibilities. A lot of #6 Dmen only play 10 minutes a night, even some #5’s only play 14 or so. But Fraser was up around 17. Those are meaningful minutes. Like I said a solid number 5.

        • djamon

          B_Leaf And who did Fraser play with mostly? Cody Franson…who was just under 19 minutes. Fraser was actually 8th in d-men ice time last year. He earned the vast majority of his ice time with one guy…Franson at even strength.
          Fraser is not a #5 on this team…nor should he be.

        • mcloki

          djamon B_Leaf Don’t worry there are guys that will push Fraser from that #5 position, or there should be. Fraser is a great 6-7 D.

        • playoff nut

          mcloki djamon B_Leaf Has to agree even though I like what he is so much I dont want to

  • Burtonboy

    Joe Colborne bulking up for any available position:
    http://kylethereporter.com/2013/07/31/joe-colborne-bulking-up-for-any-available-position/

    • Burtonboy

      Up to 222 lbs eh .

      • MaxwellHowe

        Burtonboy I hope he makes Nonis regret resigning Bozak

        • rustynail

          MaxwellHowe Burtonboy that won’t happen this season

        • Burtonboy

          MaxwellHowe Burtonboy If Bozak gets hurt it could really open the door for Joe .

      • rustynail

        Burtonboy and it sounds like it is actual muscle

        • Burtonboy

          rustynail Burtonboy Yeah if he’s up to that kind of weight with no loss in speed it would be excellent

        • rustynail

          Burtonboy rustynail if he has been working on his legs depending on how it could even increase his speed

        • Burtonboy

          rustynail Burtonboy Well he said in the interview he hasn’t lost any speed and he will be coming back to T.O early to work with Underhill again

        • Knights2Leafs

          Burtonboy
          Bah, he’s on the Nazem “fatboy” training program.  He’ll probably suck like Kadri did last year. : )

        • Dink

          Burtonboy rustynail  lol did he have any speed?

        • Burtonboy

          @Dink Burtonboy rustynail Joe’s skating has improved considerably. He sure didn’t look slow in the games he played with the Leafs

    • Conis

      Burtonboy 
      Sounds like a true team player, good for him recovering from surgery.  Seems to really understand how to work through the slow process in order to attain a strong recovery.  
      And at that size, he’s a beast.  Goto love that.

      • Optimustic

        @Conis Burtonboy Gotta think that if he turns out to be good, that we really fleeced the Bruins on the Kaberle trade.   That and the Kessel trade are two in a row from them. :-)

    • Leafbites

      Burtonboy Still not sure how he’ll fit between Orrsy and Bigmac, if that’s the plan. If they are going to play him center in the 4 hole, wouldn’t it be wiser to add a little more skill to one of those wings. I love the bombers, but this line combination feels unsettling.

      • Burtonboy

        Leafbites Burtonboy I’m hoping they won’t play both Orr and MacClaren at the same time . Put someone like an Ashton or a D’Amico on the other wing and only use Fraser when needed against tough  teams or against the Sens and Turds just to beat the shit out of em.:)

        • Leafbites

          Burtonboy Leafbites I like the idea of Ashton if he’s ready. He brings size to that line, has speed, pk’s, and is a decent grinder, down low. I don’t think anyone would have a problem if they dressed both for some of these divisional foes

        • B_Leaf

          Burtonboy Leafbites 
          I actually think we could see Colborne as the thirteenth forward starting off if everyone is healthy. D’Amigo could play third line LW and McC could play fourth line C. Obviously McC is going to get his TOI whether its jumping into D’Amigo’s spot late in games for starters or big PK minutes. But D’Amigo may give the third line a little more scoring than MacC and a little more speed. Colborne will get his minutes over the season filling for injuries or McLaren etc.

        • Greg Fenton

          Burtonboy Leafbites Why? Whats difference between playing McLaren or Ashton 5 minutes a night? Neither is likely to generate much offense. All you want out of that line is some energy and to not screw up. 
          As of right now, carrying Ashton and McLaren and Orr just adds 800,000 or 1.04 million to the cap, and they don’t really have the space for that. 
          If Ashton out plays McLaren in camp, he should and probably will play. If he doesn’t,. McLaren will play.

        • B_Leaf

          Greg Fenton Burtonboy Leafbites 
          RC will keep McLaren and Orr in the line-up most nights. There will be exceptions but not the rule. But I think D’Amigo is far ahead of Ashton and either he or Colborne is the 13th forward

        • Mind Bomb

          Greg Fenton Burtonboy Leafbites  Aston may be better than you think Greg, Certainly a step up on Mclaren, 
          Ashton-Colborne -ORR
          Not a Horrible 4th, although we probably wont have the Cap lol

        • Burtonboy

          B_Leaf Greg Fenton Burtonboy Leafbites We will see . Didn’t take long for Carlyle to sit McLaren during the playoffs and if there’s better players for that 4th line then he should sit again . As for cap we have to clear enough to carry at least one extra forward and a defense man.

        • Burtonboy

          Mind Bomb Greg Fenton Burtonboy Leafbites Yes we will . Give them a chance to work it out

        • Leafbites

          Mind Bomb Greg Fenton Burtonboy Leafbites Ashton is also decent on the pk and has much better hands in tight. Also, with Colborne, they should be able to establish a little more O-zone time then the other combination. At the end of the day, it would benefit this entire line up, if you could squeeze a little more then 5 reliable minutes a night from this group.

        • Burtonboy

          Leafbites Plus Ashton has played a fair bit of Hockey with Colborne in the minors

        • Mind Bomb

          Burtonboy Leafbites  Its a good Fit, until Jerry D explodes in Camp lol, Man going to be some Battles this year

        • Burtonboy

          Mind Bomb Burtonboy Leafbites Then we have Ashton and Jerry on the team and send McClaren to the minors ? :))))))))

        • Greg Fenton

          Mind Bomb Burtonboy Leafbites Hopefully one or two prospects make a push. 
          As I’ve said before, some people are expecting too much from too many prospects and are going to be dissapointed.

        • playoff nut

          BurtonboyLeafbites use Fraser when needed against tough  teams or against the Sens and Turds just to beat the shit out of em.:) 
           Makes my morning  :)

  • Burtonboy

    https://twitter.com/capgeek
    https://twitter.com/search?q=%23NHL&src=hash https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Leafs&src=hash Mark Fraser gets $400K in a signing bonus. http://t.co/4wqlshQfFZ

    • leafscapguru

      Burtonboy that should cover that metal plate in his head

      • Burtonboy

        leafscapguru Burtonboy LOL pretty sure the Leafs paid for that already

        • leafscapguru

          Burtonboy leafscapguru lol i know

        • mcloki

          leafscapguru Burtonboy It’s Ontario. Isn’t he covered by Health Canada? 😉

      • playoff nut

        leafscapguru Burtonboy lol U bad

  • B_Leaf

    Has anybody ever been able to confirm for sure what Komarov is making in the KHL? I heard $3M but cant find confirmation. Leo did leave his deal open to come back to NHL and he said he would like to. Leaf management has also said they would really like him back. IF…Kadri came in at 2.75 and Franson at 3.2 that would leave about 2.5 for Komarov. I guess what I am saying is that IF the Komarov deal is less than some think maybe there is still a window to bring him back. Of course for this to work Liles would have to be bought out.

    • Greg Fenton

      B_Leaf I’d rather keep Liles, the player who WANTS to be playing here.

      • B_Leaf

        Greg Fenton B_Leaf 
        Wants to be here at 3.85M

        • leafscapguru

          B_Leaf Greg Fenton JML is being bought out or traded i think its safe to say hes gone

        • Greg Fenton

          B_Leaf Greg Fenton which isn’t a bad number for him. Its not his fault the coach hasn’t used him. 
          If they decide they want to move him or buyout him and spend that money on Kadri or Franson etc…, fine. There is only so much to go around. But I certainly wouldn’t buy him out to bring Komarov back. If he’d rather play in Russia, let him play in Russia

        • B_Leaf

          Greg Fenton B_Leaf 
          Well he has made it clear his preference is to play here but the financials are the tipping point. He took less to play here last year.
          Liles really hasn’t established himself since his concussion. But maybe he bounces back…he is not terrible or anything.

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton B_Leaf personally i think if Komarov left because of money he is a genius. with a lowered cap leafs would low ball him, he could stay in game shape in the KHL do well in points and come back next year at a higher amount when the cap goes back to normal. very smart business move

        • Greg Fenton

          B_Leaf Greg Fenton He made it clear by getting on a plane and signing a contract that his preference was to play in Russia. If he wanted to play in the NHL, he’d be playing in the NHL. Its like poor Komarov has no choice but play in Russia but he really wants to be in North America. He made that choice – fine, let him play in Russia.

        • B_Leaf

          Greg Fenton B_Leaf 
          I don’t begrudge him playing in Russia, just wondering if we are able to come close in $, because he might decide to come back. He is a real asset. Thats all. Leaf management have said publicly they would really like him back…just recently.

        • Greg Fenton

          leafscapguru Greg Fenton B_Leaf I hope Nonis and Carlyle and Leiweke don’t reward a player for bailing on the team. Komarov doesn’t want to be here, I don’t want him here. 
          I’m all for players making as much as they can, getting paid fair market value, I don’t expect players to take hair cuts when they don’t have too. But Komarov bailed on the team. He could have taken a 1 year contract with the Leafs at 1 or 1.5, stayed in game shape, shown what he could do and potentially signed for more next year, WITHOUT BAILING. 
          Franson is in a similar position, probably wants to be paid more money the Leafs want to pay, can afford right now. He isn’t damnding a trade or signing in Europe or anyhting.

        • Greg Fenton

          B_Leaf Greg Fenton I would have liked to keep him, but he made his choice. He decided he’d rather make more next year then he probably would have made here in Russia, so he went. If thats where he’d rather be I don’t want him back. 
          And if to bring him back they’ll have to overpay and match or come close tow hat they paying him in Russia…..why the hell would you want to overpay for someone who would rather be in Russia? Kulemin probably could have gone to Russia and made more then 2.8 (or so) he is making now, but he wanted to be here, so he is here.

        • Greg Fenton

          B_Leaf Greg Fenton If your girlfriend breaks up with you because she wants to have sex with a better looking guy who is in better shape then you, even though she tells you you’re a better guy and she’d rather date someone like you, do you take her back a year later because she’s ready to be with you again?

        • B_Leaf

          Greg Fenton B_Leaf 
          Greg, All I’m saying is that Komarov left an openining in his KHL contract to come back if he chooses. The Leafs don’t know what they have yet to offer. MAYBE they find enough to bring him back. I just asked if anyone knew for sure what the KHL offered him. 
          Further more this is not marriage, it is business, not the same thing.

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton B_Leaf depends on how hot she is.

        • Greg Fenton

          B_Leaf Greg Fenton And I’m asking why you’d want them to reward a player who bailed on the team? 
          He left an opening…..isn’t that wonderful. He still decided to go play in Russia instead of playing for the Leafs. He doesn’t want to be here – fine, I don’t want him here. He can play in Putinstan for the next 20 years, and the Leafs can and should allocate their cap space to player who want to Maple Leafs and want to play here. 
          I’m not mad at Komarov, I don’t think he is a bad guy or anything like that. Deciding to play in the KHL is a valid choice that he decided was right for him. But he made a choice. He’d rather be there, if you don’t want to be here, then I don’t want him here. Kulemin could have done the same thing, but he’d rather be here.

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton B_Leaf who to say that the leafs aren’t happy with him going to the KHL for a year this make the cap easier for them.

        • Greg Fenton

          leafscapguru Greg Fenton B_Leaf I’m sure they are thrilled about losing a good, contributing player. He left because he wanted more then he could make/was/is worth in North America. Cool, thats his choice. But if you’d rather be in Russia making 2-3-4 million more, you can stay in Russia. I don’t want Nonis to reward him for bailing on the team.  
          And next year, won’t be any easier.

        • Mind Bomb

          Greg Fenton leafscapguru B_Leaf Hi Greg, there was an article mentioning that Koro went to play first line minutes, in order to Make the Olympic team.  which he may not have done playing 4rth line minutes here. Add the money and its not a decision he should be faulted for. I would love to play for my Country

        • Greg Fenton

          Mind Bomb Greg Fenton leafscapguru B_Leaf I’m not fauling for him for it. I’m saying I don’t want the Maple Leafs to reward players for bailing on them and to send the message that its ok for players leave like Komarov did.

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton Mind Bomb leafscapguru B_Leaf 
          you don’t know if management supported this decision

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton Mind Bomb leafscapguru B_Leaf remember it helps there cap problems and they can see which  marlie can step up

        • Greg Fenton

          Mind Bomb Greg Fenton leafscapguru B_Leaf If Kadri said tomorrow, I’m not going to sign with the Leafs or any other team, I want to be traded to the Habs. My family are Montreal fans, I like the team better, they will play me on the top line which I think would be better for my career, they can pay more because they have cap space etc…. 
          All that is fine, and I can’t blame Kadri for his decision making. But I wouldn’t want him on the Leafs anymore. Not after putting the team in that position.

        • Greg Fenton

          leafscapguru Greg Fenton Mind Bomb B_Leaf Neither do you. But logically, if the Leafs thought he’d help the team, they probably wanted him to stay.

        • Greg Fenton

          leafscapguru Greg Fenton Mind Bomb B_Leaf Well, its good he signed in Russia, robbing them of the oppertunity to trade him and gain an asset in return. Its also nice of him to take away their choice of which player(s) they wanted to part with to get under the cap.

        • Uncle Otis

          Greg Fenton 
          Hmmm…interesting analogy
          Speaking from experience? lol

        • leafscapguru

          Uncle Otis Greg Fenton i sense a little anger in him

        • Uncle Otis

          leafscapguru Uncle Otis 
          You’d be too if girls always left you for better looking guys;)

    • B_Leaf

      hoolihan B_Leaf 
      Kulemin?

      • Mind Bomb

        hoolihan B_Leaf You dont make the play offs, or go deep in them with a shitty, cheap bottom 6 bro. See Chicago, LA, Boston

      • Greg Fenton

        B_Leaf hoolihan Kulemin got a normal RFA raise from his 2.5 million dollar contract that he signed when the belief was he was a top 6 (maybe a top line) winger. 
        He also had twice as many goals and more then twice as many points as Komarov. From a production stand point, Komarov is more of a 4th liner.

      • leafscapguru

        Greg Fenton B_Leaf hoolihan maybe Komarov went to the KHL to prove he’s more than that, we don’t know what really transpired behind closed doors

      • Mind Bomb

        hoolihan Mind Bomb B_Leaf Well I am not getting into the Nationality debate, but short changing your bottom 2 lines will get you no where 
        Boston had Guys like Kelly, Peaverly etc
        Chicago Bickel and Bolland

      • Greg Fenton

        leafscapguru Greg Fenton B_Leaf hoolihan He could ahve done that in the NHL.

      • Greg Fenton

        leafscapguru Greg Fenton B_Leaf hoolihan He could done that in the NHL, and probably done a much better job of it (since it would be an apples to apples comparison) as opposed to what it would become “I did this in the KHL, but that only means this in the NHL etc….”

      • leafscapguru

        Greg Fenton leafscapguru B_Leaf hoolihan personally think your taking it like a slap in the face, in the end its a business.  the goal of the GM is to make the team the best it can possibly be and if Komarov wants to come back next year and Nonis feels it the right player i would support that decision

      • Greg Fenton

        leafscapguru Greg Fenton B_Leaf hoolihan Not all. I have no problem with his decision. If thats what is more important him and/or what the righ decision for him and his family is, then good on him. 
        I don’t want Nonis to send the message that leaving the Leafs high and dry is ok, that you can/will be rewarded for doing that. I really have malice against Komarov for his choice, I just don’t want Nonis and co. to make that choice meaningless and reward a player for bailing on the team.

    • mcloki

      B_Leaf Expect all the money to get sucked up with Kadri and Franson.

      • Burtonboy

        mcloki B_Leaf No it won’t . If Nonis does buyout Liles expect him to keep enough space for wiggle room.

    • elhefe75

      B_Leaf Only problem is we used the 2 compliance buy-outs already on Komi and Grabs….any other buy out would still count against the cap

      • B_Leaf

        elhefe75 B_Leaf 
        I’m taking that into account

    • WatsonB

      Yes Komarov has a Opt-out option in the 2nd year of his KHL agreement if he wants to come back to the NHL. If all goes well we will only be without him for a year…. two tops. *fingers crossed*

  • maximus_asinus

    I am in the minority for sure when I say that I want Colborne traded. Not because I don’t like him or what he brings to this team but because I believe the Leafs are utterly fucking up his development. I would rather him play elsewhere so he can play 3rd (possibly 2nd) line CENTRE time like he deserves.

    • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

      maximus_asinus Heard the same criticisms with Kadri and he’s turning out OK.

      • playoff nut

        ingy56 maximus_asinus And imho Joe will to ,he looks meaner mor confident now

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          playoff nut ingy56 maximus_asinus Players have to earn their positions under Carlyle and rightly so. Nobody deserves anything, they earn it instead.

        • playoff nut

          ingy56 playoff nut maximus_asinus and rightly so but Joe is special imho he will be much better this year ,I would bet something on him proving it to :)

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          playoff nut ingy56 maximus_asinus I think so too, sounds like he realizes that this is his shot and he’s putting in the required work.

        • playoff nut

          ingy56 playoff nut maximus_asinus Now I wish as he does he hadnt played injured ,Go Joe Go ,make us proud I say

      • mcloki

        ingy56 maximus_asinus I’m with Max on this. I don’t think Joe has done anything to warrant a deeper look. This training camp and beginning of the season may be his last chance to bring it. But I wouldn’t be surprised to see him packaged for something better.

    • Greg Fenton

      maximus_asinus Why does he deserve 2nd or 3rd line minutes? What has he done to earn that ice time yet?

  • http://mapleleafshotstove.com/ DeclanK

    http://kylethereporter.com/2013/07/31/joe-colborne-bulking-up-for-any-available-position/#more-3529

    • Mind Bomb

      DeclanK   BB beat you to this Dec. We all agree the Stork is filling out, looking forward to seeing him play a full 82 games this year

      • http://mapleleafshotstove.com/ DeclanK

        So he did. My bad.
        Really pulling for the guy. That size with that talent…I hope he strings it all together.
        I thought he was great in the playoffs and made the team harder to ppqy against down low.

        • Mind Bomb

          DeclanK 100 percent, I think leafs management has seen this as well with the hints that 3rd wing is the spot for him, 
          Colburne-Bolland-Kulie, giving Bolland a couple Big Wingers

  • WatsonB

    Is Kadri and Franson signed yet? God, I feel like I cant relax this off season untill I know they’re locked up, I hate this sh$t!

    • WatsonB

      And it was a joke question, I am well aware they are not actually signed yet lol

      • Kouba

        WatsonB I would give you a dislike anyways if i could lol

        • WatsonB

          Why, its not my fault your a window licker. Its a serious issue right now and if your not at least worried about it your not a true Leafs fan or your a few watts short of a lightbuld upstairs.

        • Wendelbuiltmyhotrod

          WatsonB No…you are not a true Leafs fan…..just realx dude….it will get done

  • Dangle_My_Berries

    So bolland is bringing the cup to mimico tomorrow… Practice run 😉

    • playoff nut

      Dangle_My_Berries Our cup home lol

    • rustynail

      Dangle_My_Berries and London before Mimico

      • playoff nut

        rustynail Dangle_My_Berries Of course ,how did I not say that ,Im bad .Would be worth the 20 min drive

  • leafmealone

    Totally stunned over here. Just read an article suggesting a trade between the Leafs and another team that was both logical in its reasoning, AND realistically fair to both sides. I believe the apocalypse is imminent.
    http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Colin-Dambrauskas/Cody-Franson—Could-the-Flames-Help-Out-the-Toronto-Maple-Leafs/171/53126#.UfkuUuBo0QI

    • leafscapguru

      leafmealone wont happen would rather buy out JML

      • Greg Fenton

        leafscapguru leafmealone Really? Its better to have these kind of cap penalties?
        http://www.capgeek.com/buyout-calculator/?player_id=553&buyout_y=2013&buyout_m=07&buyout_d=31

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton leafscapguru leafmealone yes it is

        • Greg Fenton

          leafscapguru Greg Fenton leafmealone No, its not.

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton leafscapguru leafmealone it might be long but it’s not bad, JML has 18 teams he can refuse a trade from he wont be traded, he might get picked up off waivers but if not that cap hit still puts us pretty for next year

    • WatsonB

      I have been a big fan of Nonis thus far and everything he’s done this off season but If we loose Franson (who finished 8th in Defencemen scoring last year) due to Nonis’s poor cap management I will personally start the “Fire nonis” Chant from Maple Leaf’s Square. I really truely believe he is smarter than this, untill something is done I still remian by his side and have faith that Nonis will not let this happen. I believe that  Franson will be a Leaf next season. He damn well better be….

      • mcloki

        WatsonB You’ll be alone in the Square.

        • WatsonB

          Seriously? You wouldnt be furious with Nonis if we loose Franson because of poor cap management? it was mistakes like that, that lead to 9 years out of the playoffs, they are unacceptable and fans like you are why GM’s get away with making major mistakes like this. I wont stand for it and if you will, well i suggest you go be a Habs fan.

        • leafscapguru

          WatsonB we are not losing Franson unless we trade for a good player in return.  The cap is under control worst case scenario is we buy out JML which gives us plenty of $ to sign Kadri and franson and carry a 23 man roster

        • mcloki

          WatsonB Who says we have cap issues? Even a quick pencil on the back of a napkin shows you’re we’re fine. Calm down, deep breath.

        • WatsonB

          I really hope your right @mcloki, personally I wont be able to take a sigh of relief untill I know that Kadri AND Franson are locked up for next year. Theyre both too good and too young to loose, I really really do hope your right and the cap isnt as big of an issue as some ghave made it seem.

        • mcloki

          WatsonB Name the last RFA’s that moved? That should reassure you.

        • WatsonB

          The Leafs went from 3rd most Cap room to like 4 worst amount of cap room in one off season… Burke set us up for this off season and all of JFJ’s mistakes have been corrected by now, im sorry to tell you bud if there are cap issues its due to the contracts Nonis signed this off season.

        • playoff nut

          WatsonB Holy shite ,habs ,thats fightin words mista lol

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          WatsonB They had the 3rd most cap room at one point this off season, but only had 14-15 players signed. It was an illusion.

        • leafscapguru

          WatsonB CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
          My Custom Lineup
          FORWARDS
          Joffrey Lupul ($5.250m) / Tyler Bozak ($4.200m) / Phil Kessel ($5.400m)
          James Van Riemsdyk ($4.250m) / Dave Bolland ($3.375m) / David Clarkson ($5.250m)
          Joe Colborne ($0.600m) / Jay McClement ($1.500m) / Nikolai Kulemin ($2.800m)
          Frazer McLaren ($0.700m) / Nazem Kadri ($2.750m) / Colton Orr ($0.925m)
          Jerry D’Amigo ($1.083m) /
          DEFENSEMEN
          Dion Phaneuf ($6.500m) / Carl Gunnarsson ($3.150m)
          Jake Gardiner ($1.117m) / Paul Ranger ($1.000m)
          Mark Fraser ($1.275m) / Cody Franson ($3.800m)
          Korbinian Holzer ($0.788m) / Petter Granberg ($0.900m)
          GOALTENDERS
          Jonathan Bernier ($2.900m)
          James Reimer ($1.800m)
          OTHER
          Buyout: Darcy Tucker ($1.000m)
          Buyout: Colby Armstrong ($1.000m)
          Buyout: John-Michael Liles ($0.875m)
          RETAINED SALARY TRANSACTIONS (0.778% of upper limit)
          Matt Frattin ($0.437m—0.5%) Ben Scrivens ($0.062m—0.1%)
          ——
          CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
          (these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
          SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,686,667; BONUSES: $612,500
          CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $225,833
          how is this cap issues?

        • leafscapguru

          WatsonB kadri supposed be on 2nd line

        • mcloki

          ingy56 WatsonB Does basic math and logic  elude today’s youth?

        • hometeem

          WatsonB JML contract is not helpin us and Grabos buyout was DM but he didntink him to that ridiculous deal

        • Greg Fenton

          WatsonB In a cap league, losing players isn’t always because of a poor cap management.

        • Aki Berg

          mcloki WatsonB The fire-Nonis site is PPP. And they are right in that assertion.

      • Wendelbuiltmyhotrod

        WatsonB It’s elementary my dear Watson….Franson and Kadri will be signed

    • Greg Fenton

      leafmealone the deal would make sense. 
      I was getting ready to say how it was silly, the Flames are rebuilding, you won’t get a top prospect or 1st rounder from them, but they made the intelligent suggestion of a mid-range prospect or pick. The biggest problemw ould be Liles NTC. 
      Moving Liles and Colborne and taking Russell back would give the Leafs roughly 7.8 million cap space, which would certainly be a big help.

      • MaxwellHowe

        Greg Fenton leafmealone IMO it would be a mistake to trade Colborne.  There are a plethora of D prospects to trade, if necessary.  Leafs are short on centre prospects, and Colborne is greatly underrated.  Again, IMO.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton leafmealone I tend to agree, big centres like Colborne are desirable prospects. I just wonder though if Gauthier’s drafting could possibly make the Leafs consider moving Joe.

        • MaxwellHowe

          ingy56 MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton 
          The other point is that we constantly go on about the need for better centres – then there’s talk (whispers from a minority, granted) of trading away someone with Colborne’s gifts and pedigree – before he even gets a fair shot?  Does this make any sense?  But, oh yes, lets sign Bozak to a $4 million contract, even though stats show his main winger plays better with any other centre.

        • Greg Fenton

          MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton leafmealone Colborne is 23, which is old(er) for a prospect. There doesn’t appear to be roll spot for him on the roster, unless he earn the 4th line (5 minute a night) job this year. Yes it is giving up a prospect, but its not like giving up a 19 year old kid with lots and lots of untapped potential.

        • leafscapguru

          Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe leafmealone colborne will be on the the wing playing with bolland so that they can score as well shut down players his size will be the big help

        • Greg Fenton

          MaxwellHowe ingy56 Greg Fenton What pedigree does Colborne have?
          And has he not been given a fair shot, or has he not impressed enough yet, at the age 23, to warrent getting more ofa  shot then he already has gotten?

        • Greg Fenton

          leafscapguru Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe leafmealone Maybe. He might not make the team out of training camp. 
          This time last year everyone was positive that Holzer was going to make the team and make an impact. 
          If they buy out Liles they WILL have those cap hits to deal with.

        • MaxwellHowe

          Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe leafmealone well when we have that 19 yr old centre with lots and lots of untapped potential, hold on to him for dear life.  For now, all we have to hold is big Joe.  Well, you hold him.  Not me.  He’s 6 foot 5 and 220 pounds after all.

        • MaxwellHowe

          Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe ingy56 1st round pick.  Had wrist injury issues, so I think he has not had his chance yet.

        • Greg Fenton

          MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton leafmealone Colborne might be a player, but probably more of a 3rd line guy, maybe a 2nd, at this point. I don’t dislike him as a prospect, I wouldn’t call him a bust at this point or anything, but lets also call a spade a spade, he isn’t a great, full of potential prospect either. And moving him and Liles to clear up that cap space and sign Kadri and Franson…….not a bad move at all.

        • MaxwellHowe

          Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe leafmealone Unless it is absolutely the only choice the Leafs have in order to sign Kadri/Franson – yes, it is a bad move.

        • Greg Fenton

          MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton leafmealone No its not. Giving up a depth prospect to free up cap space isn’t a bad move.

        • MaxwellHowe

          Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe leafmealone It is when that prospect is all the depth the Leafs have at C.

        • Greg Fenton

          MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton leafmealone lack of depth doesn’t make a prospect better. Just means the team needs to address a depth issue. 
          And while the Leafs are weak at center, its not like they have a bunch of openings or holes that need to be filled. Bozak, Kadri, Bolland, McClement could be the 4 centers on this team for 3-4-5 years to come.

        • MaxwellHowe

          Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe leafmealone so you propose to address the centre depth issue by trading a guy even you concede might one day be a second line centre.   And the Leafs are good to go with those 4 centres for the next 5 years because, of course, no one’s play might decline nor is there a chance someone might get injured.  OK

        • Greg Fenton

          MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton leafmealone I propose the lack of depth at center and possibly trading Colborne in order to sign the teams 2nd best D-man and probably best center are not related. 
          Colborne, might possible be a good 2nd line center, maybe, one day. The Leafs need more cap space to resign Kadri and Franson. 
          And they have other options besides Colborne to fill in for injuried players. They’d have too, what if 2 get hurt? ANd if they are going to hold onto COlborne just in case someones play declines, because then he can play……he isn’t a great prospect that needs to be held onto no matter what.

        • MaxwellHowe

          Greg Fenton MaxwellHowe leafmealone No Greg, but we are not at the no matter what stage, are we?  Again, if there are no other options to get the cap space to sign Kadri/Franson but trading Colborne, I guess it has to be done.  But there are many other options.

        • Greg Fenton

          MaxwellHowe Greg Fenton leafmealone There migh tbe, but moving Liles and Colborne is one of the better ones.

  • mcloki

    Seriously. If Nonis does sign Kadri and Franson in the next week. What will we talk about in August? I miss the BBQ recipes and Kamodo talk.

    • MaxwellHowe

      mcloki then in August we’ll be talk about the crappy contracts the Leafs signed with Kadri and Franson.

      • mcloki

        MaxwellHowe mcloki A signed contract is a good contract with those two guys. LAst night I heard Friedman, one of the only Toronto journalists not working at this site that I trust. He said that in three years the salary cap may be 80 million. 80 Million. that would be crazy.

        • MaxwellHowe

          mcloki MaxwellHowe Ah, there are always distractors to provoke arguments.  Thats the best thing about this site.  Always someone brave or crazy enough to argue the unpopular side of the debate.

        • mcloki

          MaxwellHowe mcloki we’re full of brave and crazy all right.

    • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

      mcloki We’ll be wondering where Grabo’s going….still.

      • mcloki

        ingy56 mcloki Washington is my guess.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          mcloki ingy56 Thought I read somewhere that they are interested but need to make another move first.

        • mcloki

          ingy56 mcloki Everyone is pretty tight now. Not too many teams have the cap space to take on contracts. You won’t see much movement. As they say the leagues dance cards are getting full. HAlf the teams are at their 23 man roster and the rest are close. Only Carolina has 19 players left. SO there’s 27 spots left on rosters in the league. The game of musical chairs is almost up.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          mcloki ingy56 Yes, the music is about to stop.

    • WatsonB

      Yea, your right…. lets not sign two of our most skilled RFA’s so that we have something to continue to talk about through the month of August, God Im glad your nopt the Leafs GM.

      • WatsonB

        lol why? Because I wouldnt let our two most talented RFA’s sit in limbo without contracts through the month of August just for the sake of something to talk about? Yea, what a bad GM move that would be.

      • leafscapguru

        WatsonB no because you would give them what they want its called negotiating

      • WatsonB

        lol yea, because thats exactly what I said, fyi: putting words in peoples mouths is not how you win arguements.

      • mcloki

        WatsonB Montreal did it to Subby last year. That worked out.

      • WatsonB

        haha, this picture is a joke, I use it as an avatar for my fantasy hockey team name Multiple Scorgasms. Your the one with the avatar of what looks to be the creepiest looking pedophile thats ever walked the earth.

      • mcloki

        WatsonB it’s evil Abed from Community.

      • WatsonB

        Yea, lucky for them they did, because at any point in time another team could of walked in and signed him to an offer sheet, thats a smart option to have looming over your RFA’s through the entire summer.

      • mcloki

        WatsonB Again when was the last offer sheet that worked. And in a low cap season. Both getting offer sheeted over 3. What’s that 2 firsts, a second and a third. it would be interesting.

      • leafscapguru

        WatsonB not many teams that can do offer sheets plus the player has to want to sign it

      • WatsonB

        I dont care who his avatar is, using one’s avatar picture to try to win an arguement is clearly a last resort for someone that has no real hockey knowledge to back up his arguements. Whats the next step, critize my grammar? lmao

      • hometeem

        mcloki WatsonB not even close
        up to 3.3 is only a 2nd

      • mcloki

        hometeem mcloki WatsonB the Leafs would match that easily so they would have to offer higher.

      • leafscapguru

        mcloki hometeem WatsonB that would be cheaper than what they want it to be probably

      • leafscapguru

        mcloki hometeem WatsonB Kadri signs for 2.75 for 2 years and Franson signs for 3.8 for 4 years

      • leafscapguru

        mcloki hometeem WatsonB very fair contracts i think and we would be fine for cap with buying out JML

      • hometeem

        leafscapguru mcloki hometeem WatsonBOver $3,364,391 to $5,046,585 – 1st round pick, 3rdprob where these goys fit in, i still think naz gets more than 3

      • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

        leafscapguru mcloki hometeem WatsonB Those numbers sound fair, only thing is if you are buying some of Franson’s UFA seasons it could cost more. I’m not sure how many seasons that would be though.

      • dlb eh

        WatsonB 
        you missed the humour in that one, eh?

    • Wendelbuiltmyhotrod

      mcloki most likely a lot of people will complain that we signed them….that’s what is supposed to happen here right?

      • mcloki

        Wendelbuiltmyhotrod mcloki So true.But it’s just maddening sometimes.

  • clark sittler

    Does anyone know the cap charge of buying out Komisarek? He only had one year left i believe.

    • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

      clark sittler Compliance buyout…no charge. Hindsight being what it is… I would have used the compliance buyout on Liles and bought out Komo with a regular buyout instead. But, what do I know?

      • leafscapguru

        ingy56 clark sittler komi’s buy out would have affected the cap more this year and next this was a numbers decision and 3rd year the cap will be much higher

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          leafscapguru ingy56 clark sittler Two years pain vs. six if they buy out Liles. A good manager can’t count on the cap rising either.

        • mcloki

          ingy56 leafscapguru clark sittler And there is still  an outside possibility that they can sign KAdri and Franson and keep Liles and still be under the cap.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          mcloki ingy56 leafscapguru clark sittler I agree.

        • hometeem

          leafscapguru ingy56 clark sittler no matter what the cap is if the moneys not on the ice its a competetive disadvantage

        • mcloki

          hometeem leafscapguru ingy56 clark sittler Comment of the Week. NIcely done.

        • hometeem

          mcloki ingy56 leafscapguru clark sittler no chnace in hell, less than 2.5 each not gunna happen

  • clark sittler

    Does anyone know the cap charge of a regular buyout of Komisareks contract then? It would be interesting to compare the cap charges. I believe Nonis should have used a compliance buyout on Liles and a regular buyout for Komisarek. Nonis really screwed up.

    • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

      clark sittler I believe it was $2.3 per season x 2 against the cap.

      • leafscapguru

        ingy56 clark sittler where JML is around 900k for the next 2 seasons

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          leafscapguru ingy56 clark sittler Yes, and year 3 it jumps to $2.3 and then back to around 900k for 3 more I believe. I think buying out Liles would be a very bad move.

        • leafscapguru

          ingy56 leafscapguru clark sittler i don’t like it either but its our last case scenario which gets us to sign Franson and Kadri and carry a 23 man roster

        • leafscapguru

          Murph2417 ingy56 leafscapguru clark sittler you are right murph

        • mcloki

          leafscapguru Murph2417 ingy56 clark sittler its up in this very article.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Murph2417 ingy56 leafscapguru clark sittler Yes…correct….whats 300 grand these days right? :)

        • leafscapguru

          ingy56 Murph2417 leafscapguru clark sittler soon they they will round up just like the penny

  • clark sittler

    I believe he had 1 year left at 4.5 mil.

  • HeatherRickAkin

    While no one could question Mark Frasers heart, its his noggin that’s the problem. Marks game has relied on true grit and the willingness to drop the mitts, and every team needs a guy like that. Can he still safely play that way ? If he can, great…a good signing. If he can no longer be the guy who put up with NO nonsense around the Leaf net, or towards his teammates , then, his signing is questionable . He was a useful warrior. Maybe he still is. And JM Liles ? This poor guy must think everyone who has ever watched a Leaf game thinks he is on the fast train out of Tee Oh . Kinda looks that way .

  • Sk8trBoi

    Anyone know if there are any teams that are struggling to hit the cap floor?

    • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

      Sk8trBoi I believe every team has hit the cap floor so far, even the Islanders.

      • 4evrblue

        ingy56 Sk8trBoi I believe you’re right

        • Xxxxxnew

          Isles are at $44 mil with 23 players signed

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Xxxxxnew CapGeek’s showing them @ 49 million. $44 million  is the floor correct?

        • Xxxxxnew

          You’re right on both counts. I was looking at their actual salary hit by mistake, which is $44 mill this year.

  • wendelsway1

    Afternoon Gents….plenty of time to get both Kadri and Franson signed….don’t have to be under the cap until after training camp.  Nonis will find a way to get both Franson and Kadri signed….no need to rush…both are RFA’s and negotiating is part of the process….give the guy some time to make the necessary moves.  Fail to see how Nonis has this team in cap hell, like a few suggest.  Seems to me that he would not have been given a five year contract extension if he didn’t know how to manage a team in a salary cap leaugue.  :)

    • dlb eh

      wendelsway1 
      friedman’s been sitting in for mccown for a week or so.  seems the more opportunity he has to talk about things, the less smart i find him.  i’ve heard him use the term “cap hell”.  his reasoning is always flawed, leaving out very large parts of the argument, and no one on the air with him seems capable of suggesting anything any different than he is.  so, perhaps we have a lot of his fans here?

      • Dink

        dlb eh wendelsway1 I don’t know why Toronto’s in any more cap hell than almost every other team…press is making this such a big obnoxious deal.

  • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

    https://twitter.com/JoshRimerHockeyhttps://twitter.com/JoshRimerHockey/status/362617563307450368
    The Florida Panthers have signed Scott Gomez to a 1yr Contract!

    • 4evrblue

      ingy56 HA!!!

      • Tim Horton

        HA!

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Tim Horton I always though Tallon was smart.

      • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

        4evrblue ingy56 Have to wonder why they wouldn’t take a flyer on Grabo instead. Gomez isn’t going to demand the same kind of icetime I guess.

        • rustynail

          ingy56 4evrblue or the same $

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          rustynail ingy56 4evrblue Yes, Grabo would cost double at least.

        • Xxxxxnew

          Have to wonder if Grabbo’s rant has something to do with it.

  • Pent_House

    I’d say leafs would have traded Liles already if they could. Just buy him out at the end of this week and be done with it.

    • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

      Pent_House I know they aren’t often trading partners but I have to wonder why Buffalo wouldn’t take a look. Their defense doesn’t look so good.

      • Mind Bomb

        ingy56 Pent_House  Hi Ingy, Buffaloss should stay that way, especially if they are moving Vanek. Liles can help a Contender, its just not many have Cap space, Minny could really use Liles

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Mind Bomb There’s a few teams that can use him, I sense there is some kind of waiting game/showdown occurring.

        • Xxxxxnew

          Limited no trade contract cuts down the trade choices.

    • Mind Bomb

      Pent_House Hey PH I am curious if Nonis is Trying to Buy UFA years on Kadri or Franson, If that is the hold up. The Dollars are Tight yes, but on bridge deals he should be able to work it, But like a lot of teams these days, nonis may be negotiating longer deals at a higher rate than we anticipate. The Buyout, or lack thereof on Liles my gives some clues

      • Pent_House

        ingy56 I’d move him to anyone really, I wouldn’t really be too concerned about moving him to a division opponent. Even the Habs can have him.  

        Mind Bomb If he’s trying to get a longer deal for both guys, and not give Kadri a bridge, then Liles definitely has to be gone off the roster. I wouldn’t be opposed to giving both guys a long-term deal. My guess is the buy-out on friday or saturday whenever that next buy-out window opens.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Pent_House I’m sure they would move him anywhere too, I’d much prefer losing a prospect with him than to pay a cap hit to have him play elsewhere . We are all speculating though, there could very well be a market for Liles but Nonis is holding off for reasons known only to the inner sanctum.

        • leafscapguru

          ingy56 Pent_House i hope so to, but have a feeling we get nothing for JML but i don’t think he will clear waivers someone will pick him up

        • Mind Bomb

          ingy56 Pent_House  Cronin did not sound 100 percent confident that Gardiner or Ranger would fill a top 4 role this year, Gardiner in the Future but atm they may feel they still need liles

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          leafscapguru ingy56 Pent_House I’d be fine with that too, he only cost a 2nd to obtain. I just hate the buyout option. I loved Darcy Tucker, but seeing him on the cap every year just pisses me off for some reason (Thanks so much for that Bettsy)

    • Dink

      Pent_House I don’t think that they would have already traded him if they could..
      a lot of teams are watching Philly and others to see what players are offered…
      when they start moving, watch out

  • Xxxxxnew

    Here’s the cap hit on a Liles buyout
    2013-14: $875,000
    2014-15: $875,000
    2015-16: $2,375,000
    2016-17: $1,250,000
    2017-18: $1,250,000
    2018-19: $1,250,000

    • Pent_House

      Xxxxxnew Get er done. By 15-16 season, we’ll have all our key players locked up.

      • Xxxxxnew

        Armstrong and Tucker are off the books next year, cap should go up especially with the new CBC deal kicking in this season.

        • rustynail

          Xxxxxnew and most of the NBC deal plus 7 million outdoor games

        • Dink

          Xxxxxnew thats Kessels money

    • dlb eh

      Xxxxxnew 
      every time i see Tucker’s name on our CAP it irritates me.  and then Army was added to it.
      no way i want to see another guy on that list beyond this coming year, who isn’t contributing to the team on the ice.  screw that.  find another way.

  • ErikGruber

    How can we not be able to move Liles? I’m sure are able to retain salary. Even if we retain $1M in salary, isn’t that better then 4 years of $1-2M in buyout? Who wouldn’t take Liles for $2.8M that has cap space?

    • Area49th

      ErikGruber Doesn’t he have a LNTC?

      • leafscapguru

        Area49th ErikGruber yes he does and chance are the teams that can take that contract are the teams he doesn’t want to go to

        • Mind Bomb

          leafscapguru Area49th ErikGruber  Hey John want to go to Calgary ? 
          Umm No !

        • ErikGruber

          leafscapguru Area49th ErikGruber I would love to be a fly in the wall on this one. I just hate the fact that we might not get anything back for him. Then again, we did that with Grabo. Same situation where the player does not fit into the coach’s philosophy(I assume this is true because he was scratched so many times).

        • leafscapguru

          ErikGruber leafscapguru Area49th you can blame nonis for that that just the result of a lowered cap.  im sure its a company write off in the end

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          leafscapguru Area49th ErikGruber I think for the most part those NTC’s are designed simply so the player has some input into where he might go. I sense that is a player had a choice between taking a leadership role in a young team and playing regularly or being a healthy scratch on a regular basis. he would waive and go. If they communicate the options to a player instead of arbitrarily sending him on his way I think the player will be receptive.

      • Xxxxxnew

        He can list 18 teams he doesn’t want to go to. Nothing says he wouldn’t be willing to expand it a bit.

        • leafscapguru

          Xxxxxnew 18 teams wow that’s a lot.

        • leafscapguru

          Xxxxxnew i think there willing to risk putting JML on waivers and gamble that some team picks him up worst case they take the hit which isn’t that bad only its long

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          leafscapguru Xxxxxnew I’m not sure about this, but if he isn’t claimed they could send him down and $925,000 would count on the cap. It’s virtually the same as his buyout hit, yet they still retain the services of the player should injury/trade happen. I wonder if this is an option?

        • Xxxxxnew

          I think that’s the way it works. Could be the solution until after training camp when teams have a better idea about their rosters, injuries.

        • leafscapguru

          ingy56 leafscapguru Xxxxxnew no isn’t it take off $925,000 off his cap and the rest still is there

        • Xxxxxnew

          Yep.

        • Mind Bomb

          ingy56 leafscapguru Xxxxxnew  hi ingy its the other way around we only save 925 on the Cap bro

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Xxxxxnew If so, why not do it? If they lose him on waivers, so be it. If not, they bide their time and wait until another team can use him  or the Leafs need him. Shitty way to treat a vet, but it’s the cap world. They basically free up $2.9 million by doing it. Better than a buyout imo because MLSE has the cash to keep paying him until they get a return.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Mind Bomb ingy56 leafscapguru Xxxxxnew Ahh, ok…knew it was something like that. I hate this cap shit man…let the best team win.

        • rustynail

          ingy56 leafscapguru Xxxxxnew  925K WOULD NOT count on his cap hit

        • Mind Bomb

          ingy56 Mind Bomb leafscapguru Xxxxxnew Fuckin Eh bro, I hear you.

        • http://i.imgur.com/MyKj5C3.gif ingy56

          Mind Bomb ingy56 leafscapguru Xxxxxnew I hate Bettsy for making us care more about contracts and caps than players. All so his shitty teams in shitty markets with shitty owners can exist.

        • Xxxxxnew

          Detroit was spending $77 million a season over 10 years ago and Leaf fans were bitching about it

        • rustynail

          Xxxxxnew well look what we were spending our money on :)

        • Bobsyouruncle

          Xxxxxnew Capgeek says his LAST contract NTC allowed a list of 18 teams. His present contract doesn’t say what the conditions are. Do you have more information?

  • whalz

    heres what im thinking,  NONIS holds all the cards, Kadri will sign 1st for 2.5-3mil leaving 3-3.25 for franson to resign,,
    there is no rush for  NONIS to panic on Franson as we can always give Reilly a look for the 1st 8-9gms…SUBBAN held out and resigned for peanuts, Franson is in the same situation….

    • leafscapguru

      @whalz it may come to that

    • Mind Bomb

      @whalz  Subban got Screwed though and MTL is going to Pay for that on his next contract, no home town discount there

      • rustynail

        Mind Bomb Subban was also a 1 /2 year contract not two with most of the cash in the 2nd year

      • whalz

        doesnt Matter, that gave the Habs 1 1/2 yrs to move out players and to make rooom for the big contract he deserves….Franson needs to show the leafs that he is deserving of a 4mil contract,,,,,i project a 1-2 yr deal for 3mil

      • whalz

        and when you say screwed thats exactly why RFAS with  no Arb rights is supposed to be handled,,,,,,,these ridiculous contracts that these gms were signing and locking up potential franchise players was a joke,,,look at BB when he signed Kessel to a 5.2 mil contract (he was legit) and was established.  Hall, eberle, seguin have struggled since those contracts were signed

        • Mind Bomb

          @whalz  
          A) Seguin Sucks
          B) Hall’s a pussy
          C) Eberle can rebound
          It does work for some IE Tavares, and its bad forced contracts that can make a player leave once FA arrives, treat a young star like shit dont com crying when he leaves.

        • playoff nut

          Mind Bomb Hey U ! I like Hall u r a yanno lol

        • Mind Bomb

          playoff nut Mind Bomb hahaa :) Thats cool bro

        • playoff nut

          Mind Bomb playoff nut lol

        • Jmessih

          Hall’s not a pussy

        • Mind Bomb

          Jmessih  Based on all his Fighting Majors ?, or his complete seasons of Hockey ?

        • playoff nut

          Jmessih Maybe a little reckles but I think he has learned to play better/safer with the big boys finnaly ,would look great in the blue and white

        • Jmessih

          Bases on his full out 100% go reckless style of play, he gives hits, takes hit and goes to high traffic areas to score. Kid put up 50 points in 45 games last year had to get dirty to do that

        • Jmessih

          ya for sure

        • playoff nut

          Jmessih Thinking what a trade he would be for say Kuli,blacker ,holtser,and maybe abbot

    • Xxxxxnew

      On the surface Subban’s contract looked like peanuts but in terms of salary he got $2 million for 42 games last seasons and will get $3.7 mil this year. And in 10 months from now Ca-Ching!

    • dlb eh

      @whalz 
      i think it’ll play out the opposite.  i suspect Kadri’s negotiation is on hold until they see what they can give him.  then Nonis goes to Kadri’s agent palms up and says “this is what we got left and we’d like to keep everything together, so how about you work with us now and with a good year we’ll look after you later”

      • whalz

        disagree…..we have more depth at d and the recent signings of all puckmovers is as great move by Nonis

    • Dink

      @whalz I think Nonis does hold all the cards…
      a lot of teams are looking for defence
      patience is a virtue

    • Greg Fenton

      @whalz O’Reilly held out and got 5 million, give or take, when the Flames sent him an offer sheet…….

  • dlb eh

    It’s a pretty good indication we’re headed in the right direction when we can consider losing both Grabovski and Liles for nothing, and still feel
    – our team could be even better next year
    – our farm team will feature a lot of young character kids
    – prejecting all our current players, and the cap economics, we’ll be able to continue to improve our team without shackles in the future
    …and the other shoe still hasn’t even dropped

    • dlb eh

      projecting anyone?  i was premature on the ‘jecting there, and there’s no ability to edit of course

      • rustynail

        dlb eh copy then delete and repost edited one

        • dlb eh

          rustynail dlb eh 
          wow.  i never even thought of that.  thanks rusty

        • Mind Bomb

          dlb eh rustynail  The wisdom of Age DLB :))))))
          JK Rusty lol

    • Bobsyouruncle

      dlb eh How often do teams lose players for nothing that scored 20+ goals in 3 of the last 4 years and use a compliance buyout to do it. You can feel good about where the team is headed but this was lousy asset management. Thanks Randy.

    • Greg Fenton

      dlb eh Neither Grabovski or Liles were all that important to the Leafs “success” last season, and even then I’m not sure what great improvement people are expecting. 
      Why would Grabovski and Liles have any impact, one way or the other, on the farm system?
      Define “continue to improve our team”. After next off-season, if they resign their core guys, they will pretty much be locked in with very little ability to add other/different/more top end talent without making moves to clear salary.

  • Dink

    The fans on other team sites think Nonis is desperate and has to give players away.
    I think they are going to be very disappointed.

    • Jmessih

      Same, or at least lets hope so.
      There is no reason to trade away some of our player, and if Nonis really hardballs this he could sign Kadri and Franson without trading liles

  • Knights2Leafs

    Is there anything preventing either or both of Kadri and Franson signing a cap friendly 1 year deal today and then over the next couple of months *negotiate* longer term deals with higher salaries?
    Example:  Franson signs a 1 year deal tomorrow at $3M and then on September 20th signs an extension for 3 years at $4.5M per year.

    • Dink

      Knights2Leafs putting a lot of trust in mgt lol  
      they might think you suck by then

    • rustynail

      Knights2Leafs why wait? sign a 1 yr contract and as soon as it is official they should be eligible for an extension starting next season. Sign both at once and submit them sequentially :)

      • Knights2Leafs

        rustynail
        LOL – to have some semblance of not conspiring to circumvent the cap.  *Negotiate* hard for a good 45 days or so.

  • ErikGruber

    I don’t know why Franson can’t just sign for $3M now and get 3.5, 4, 4.5 in the next few seasons. Although even if Kadri signs at $2.5M we will barely have cap space for an extra forward 6.2 – 3 = 3.2 – 2.5 = $700K

    • Black_Hawk

      ErikGruber some work to do for sure

    • Greg Fenton

      ErikGruber He could get hurt in his next game and never be able to sign another contract. 
      I think a 1 year contract for Franson would be best for both parties

      • ErikGruber

        Greg Fenton ErikGruber I don’t understand your logic. Players get hurt all the time. Is there something I’m missing?

        • Greg Fenton

          ErikGruber Greg Fenton You asked why Franson can’t (and by that I took you mean “won’t, hasn’t, isn’t” rather then literial “is there a rule”, if I’m wrong then, my mistake) sign for 3 million now and in 2-3 seasons sign a bigger contract. 
          What if Franson gets hurt and his career is over before he can sign that bigger contract? He’d wouldn’t be too happy leaving money ont he table and then losing his ability to ever get it again.

        • ErikGruber

          Greg Fenton ErikGruber Ohh, actually I meant he would sign a contract where his salary increases by 500K every year(3, 3.5, 4, 4.5) But actually that wouldn’t work because his AAV would be 3.75 D’OH!

  • dlb eh

    Greg Fenton
    2 years ago, both Liles and Grabovski were good players that we couldn’t have done without.
    losing them this summer, and still being able to ice a team that is no worse than last year, is a testiment to our current skill and depth.
    we have top end skilled players to build around (rather, we have choices as to which to choose from which means we are not limitted to only one option).
    we will be able to assess the play, once again, of the team over the course of the year to determine who to keep as the core players, and who we should move out. we will scout to see who we might add to improve our team.
    the prospects are developing, perhaps not to be the front line guys we count on to win us games, but to be the supporting cast that will fill out an ever-improving roster.

    • Alec Brownscombe

      hoolihan dlb eh Greg Fenton That contract was a total mystery. The term, the timing, everything. I was Burke’s biggest defender and never got that one.

      • Bobsyouruncle

        Alec Brownscombe   
        Alec, unrelated but will the past comments from before livefyre be imported or is that not going to happen now?

  • Burtonboy

    https://twitter.com/strombone1
    Is this some kind of sick joke https://twitter.com/Budweiser ??? http://t.co/yzBnDBuavG

    • playoff nut

      Burtonboy Yummmm beer ,wait that should be Canadian ,I want a Canadian damit

      • Komas Taberle

        playoff nut Burtonboy Canadian are owned by Molson change your brand of beer!

        • playoff nut

          Komas Taberle playoff nut Burtonboy O fuc thats right ,ricards red then ,and Im off to the liquid store