Brendan Shanahan scrummed with the media after announcing Kyle Dubas as the team’s new General Manager, talking about Dubas’ development since entering the league, his relationship with Mike Babcock, and much more.
Where has Kyle made his greatest strides? You’ve got to feel very happy with the job he’s done with the Marlies from four years ago to where he is right now.
Shanahan: I just think, in watching Kyle, he came in here with a great knowledge and a great work ethic, but I think just having the ability to glean from some of the people who have been around here with him and just around the NHL with other teams and some of the people he’s been able to rub elbows with at the professional level… dealing with players, dealing with families, dealing with a lot of the stuff that isn’t necessarily seen. I’ve always had great respect for his knowledge of players and finding good players, but I think, for the role of GM – whether it’s an NHL team or an American league team – it’s a lot of the stuff the cameras don’t catch, that don’t necessarily make a hockey game, that go into the preparation that I’ve been really impressed with.
What were some of the things, when you first met Kyle, that kind of made you realize this was somebody you wanted to be a part of your organization?
Shanahan: I liked the way he thought. To me, there seems to be in the hockey world – I don’t know why, it’s kind of crazy – this fight between analytics and old school. To me, it’s a silly fight. The smartest people I’ve met in hockey are the people who have found a way to sort of seamlessly bridge the two. Information is not necessarily the answer, but it’s the beginning of asking the right questions. At a young age, when Kyle came to the meeting with me, I just thought that he had very effortlessly assumed that role with the Sault Ste. Marie Greyhounds. At the time, it was about trying to get another smart mind into the Leafs organization. The rest was really up to Kyle, whether or not he’d grow to be ready for this next step. I feel that he has.
There are some guys that are very experienced that he’s going up against. You obviously have the confidence he can sit across the table from these guys and deal with them.
Shanahan: I do. I would say that people would underestimate Kyle if they just looked at his birth certificate. He’s a humble, hard-working, smart person who has good relationships in the game with other hockey officials, other people in management – scouts and the like – because he is an open-minded, respectful person. But he’s as comfortable sitting in an office with some of our R&D guys as he is comfortable sitting in the office with Lou, or Cliff Fletcher and hearing stories from them. I think he has an appreciation for both. It is a competitive world out there. I think he’s been at the hockey game at a young age, but he’s still relatively inexperienced. But I think he’s more experienced than people give him credit for if all they look at is his birth certificate.
What do you remember about the first meeting you had with Kyle?
Shanahan: That we had to go to dinner. We went to a pizza place I used to go to in high school. I have to eat or I just can’t work. It was a long afternoon that went into the evening. We just had a good conversation about the game. Like I said, it was just something where at a certain point in that meeting, I just thought that we would be a better organization if this young man becomes a part of it.
He said the hardest work is still ahead. Where do you think the biggest challenge remains going forward?
Shanahan: I think, for all NHL teams, it’s certainly a challenge to become a good team. If you want to take that next step to be a great team, it’s even harder. For the golfers out there, it’s like the difference between getting your handicap down to a 12 and then once you get down to there, to knock one stroke off… and I don’t golf, but to become the best at anything, as you get closer to being the best, I think it takes more time and the decisions become more difficult. There is more on the line. I think that’s what he’s saying when he says the hardest work is still ahead of us. It’s true. I said three or four years ago, when we started down this path, that even the teams at the time who were winning Stanley Cups go through difficulties and strife every day and they’re not walking down sidewalks clicking their heels. It is hard to become a good team and even harder to stay a good team. We still have a ways to go.
What was Mark Hunter’s reaction to the news that he didn’t get the job?
Shanahan: Mark was a pro. Mark does a lot for this organization. He is qualified to do this job. It was difficult to have that conversation with him, but I think — I don’t want to put words in his mouth – he was at least happy it was Kyle that was going to get it. They have a lot of respect for each other. But he was certainly disappointed because Mark is certainly qualified and Mark does way more for this organization than people realize and has done. He’s as responsible as anybody for its growth. But certainly he was disappointed and I think we will all circle back as an organization in a couple of days and start talking about the future.
Looking back three years ago when you signed Lou to a three-year contract, was the plan all along that, if it works out, Kyle would succeed Lou and take his job at this time?
Shanahan: I think it’s important to try to have foresight, but at the same time, you have to re-assess where you are and what you are doing every day and every week. By no means are you bound to anything, but I do think it’s important to at least try to have some sort of foresight and planning, and then when the time comes, I don’t think you rely on old judgements, but you re-assess them and make a decision at that moment. This wasn’t about an idea or a decision that was made three years ago. There is a lot that has gone on between now and then that got me and Kyle to the table yesterday to hammer out a deal for him to be our next GM.
During that nine-hour meeting, did you think at any point that this guy was going to be an NHL GM one day? Did that click right away?
Shanahan: I think, at the time, what I just really thought was that this was someone who was going to help our organization. I needed help. I was looking for help. It was more than just Kyle. But, at the time, I was just focused on taking the first steps as an organization. I would say it was shortly after that, as I observed him over the next year, where I thought, at some point, he’s going to be a GM in this league.
Can you speak to what the dynamic might be like between him and Mike?
Shanahan: Well, I think Mike likes to be energized by ideas and loves to be challenged and loves to challenge you. I think that there are a lot of people outside of our organization that sort of make very simple assessments of who each person is and what they must believe in. I think they maybe underestimate how much back-and-forth our management team does have. I’ve seen Mike and Kyle work well together in the past and throw ideas back and forth. They’re both people with strong opinions and both people with a lot of respect for each other. I talked to Mike. Mike’s very happy with the decision and really looking forward to getting to work with Kyle.
What is the relationship like between a GM and coach when it comes to a GM acquiring players and the coaches playing players?
Shanahan: I’ll refer back to Lou on this. Lou, I thought… the one thing that impressed me about Lou, even hearing about some of his days in New Jersey, was the balance he had as a GM in acquiring players and including the coach in that decision process. I think that is the way it is. A general manager can acquire players, but getting the coach on board and getting a coach’s input is important because it’s a partnership. A coach has to have trust and faith or the player is not going to get on the ice. It is a dance. I think that Lou has done it really well over the years and I saw him do it here. It’s about including Mike in the information process – not always agreeing with Mike, but making sure he is heard.
